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+2011-04-19.txt:18:35:15: <elliott> <crystal-cola> the poeple in #python nput me off of python
+2011-04-19.txt:18:35:19: <elliott> <crystal-cola> annoyed
+2011-04-19.txt:18:35:22: <elliott> <crystal-cola> this channel sucks
+2011-04-19.txt:18:35:30: <elliott> <crystal-cola> people are naturally horrible to each other
+2011-04-20.txt:17:12:26: <crystal-cola> baez interview yudkowski
+2011-04-20.txt:17:13:21: <crystal-cola> elliott
+2011-04-20.txt:17:13:30: <crystal-cola> did you read it
+2011-04-20.txt:17:14:02: <crystal-cola> baez asks some interesting questions and yudkowski says "I'm writing a book"
+2011-04-20.txt:17:14:21: <crystal-cola> http://johncarlosbaez.wordpress.com/2011/03/07/this-weeks-finds-week-311/
+2011-04-20.txt:17:15:23: <crystal-cola> two parts so far but more to come
+2011-04-20.txt:17:15:55: <crystal-cola> why is there no transhumanism IRC
+2011-04-20.txt:17:21:23: <crystal-cola> whats up
+2011-04-20.txt:17:22:00: <crystal-cola> say something interesting
+2011-04-20.txt:17:23:25: <crystal-cola> HRUPHRG
+2011-04-20.txt:17:24:00: <crystal-cola> this isn't internet relay programming
+2011-04-20.txt:17:30:49: <crystal-cola> ;/
+2011-04-20.txt:17:32:03: <crystal-cola> elliott: what's the right thing to do ?
+2011-04-20.txt:17:32:25: <crystal-cola> some people think everyone should have fun
+2011-04-20.txt:17:39:05: <crystal-cola> so what is the conclusion
+2011-04-20.txt:17:39:19: <crystal-cola> I want answers
+2011-04-20.txt:17:41:40: <crystal-cola> science is based on the unjustifiable assumption that the world conforms to logic
+2011-04-20.txt:17:42:25: <crystal-cola> what wave
+2011-04-20.txt:17:42:39: <crystal-cola> I dont know what you mean
+2011-04-20.txt:17:43:27: <crystal-cola> bisexual is sexist
+2011-04-20.txt:17:44:51: <crystal-cola> bisexuality = mysogeny
+2011-04-20.txt:17:46:21: <Gregor> <crystal-cola> bisexuality = mysogeny // lol, I'd love to hear the logic behind this X-D
+2011-04-20.txt:17:47:52: <crystal-cola> oklopol: Nothing is more demeaning to a women than a ``bisexual'' mans distaste and fundamental non-acceptance of her femininity
+2011-04-20.txt:17:48:05: <crystal-cola> it is akin to spousal abuse
+2011-04-20.txt:17:48:12: <crystal-cola> at a psychosexual level
+2011-04-20.txt:17:48:30: <crystal-cola> see here http://www.mit.edu/~thistle/v9/9.06/4bisexuality.html
+2011-04-20.txt:17:48:33: <crystal-cola> bisexuality and feminism
+2011-04-20.txt:17:49:02: <crystal-cola> of course I didn't use logic
+2011-04-20.txt:17:49:40: <crystal-cola> I don't try to force the false ideals of logic onto everythingg
+2011-04-20.txt:17:50:01: <crystal-cola> Gregor: yes but if you read it you'd see that she's completely wrong
+2011-04-20.txt:17:50:57: <crystal-cola> There is no reason to use logical or rational thought, the only justification for doing so is because you enjoy it
+2011-04-20.txt:17:51:54: <crystal-cola> elliott: Assuming logic is true, then since you used logic your argument is false
+2011-04-20.txt:17:52:38: <crystal-cola> I have presented a definitive ``illogical'' refutation of your argument
+2011-04-20.txt:17:53:17: <crystal-cola> you're assuming that true = false, that's not provable
+2011-04-20.txt:17:53:34: <crystal-cola> So you agree with me
+2011-04-20.txt:17:55:12: <crystal-cola> As Ayn Rand said,
+2011-04-20.txt:17:56:20: <crystal-cola> bbl
+2011-04-20.txt:18:06:59: <crystal-cola> elliott: she said that the universe defines order, so there is no such thing as an unordered universe
+2011-04-20.txt:18:08:22: <crystal-cola> why is it meaningless?
+2011-04-20.txt:18:09:55: <crystal-cola> "The fake philosophical terminology of mathematical logic has misled philosophers into believing that mathematical logic deals with the truth in the philosophical sense. But this is a mistake. Mathematical logic deals not with the truth, but with the game of truth." - Rota
+2011-04-20.txt:18:13:48: <crystal-cola> I don't think it's meaningless. The point is that if you exist in some universe then "order" is whatever you perceive
+2011-04-20.txt:18:18:38: <crystal-cola> :/
+2011-04-20.txt:18:21:27: <crystal-cola> hello
+2011-04-20.txt:18:24:54: <crystal-cola> Underwater creatures
+2011-04-20.txt:18:25:15: <crystal-cola> elliott: why aren't you more interesting
+2011-04-20.txt:18:25:24: <crystal-cola> all you say is what im bored
+2011-04-20.txt:18:25:45: <crystal-cola> you star
+2011-04-20.txt:18:25:46: <crystal-cola> t
+2011-04-20.txt:18:26:01: <crystal-cola> forth is boring
+2011-04-20.txt:18:42:05: <crystal-cola> hello
+2011-04-20.txt:20:17:25: <crystal-cola> These individuals are just as emotionally driven and biased as the rest of us, but they're able to generate more and better reasons to explain why they're right—and so their minds become harder to change.
+2011-04-20.txt:20:18:10: <crystal-cola> what do you want
+2011-04-20.txt:20:20:34: <crystal-cola> Top epidemiologist Jim Carrey claims that vaccinations are causing autism
+2011-04-20.txt:20:21:40: <Phantom_Hoover> 20:20:34: <crystal-cola> Top epidemiologist Jim Carrey claims that vaccinations are causing autism
+2011-04-20.txt:21:28:59: <crystal-cola> uh
+2011-04-20.txt:21:29:00: <crystal-cola> how is that J
+2011-04-20.txt:21:31:29: <crystal-cola> you can but.... Y would you?
+2011-04-20.txt:21:31:50: <crystal-cola> haskell doesn't need Y combinators, U is enough due to lazyness
+2011-04-20.txt:21:31:59: <crystal-cola> fixed point combinators other than Y
+2011-04-20.txt:21:35:17: <crystal-cola> not the one I learned in SICP
+2011-04-20.txt:21:35:28: <crystal-cola> Y NOT?
+2011-04-20.txt:21:37:04: <crystal-cola> lol
+2011-04-20.txt:21:38:05: <crystal-cola> The sad thing is most programmers are already ultrafinitists
+2011-04-20.txt:21:38:25: <crystal-cola> using languages that dont admit infinite lists and such
+2011-04-20.txt:21:40:54: <crystal-cola> rapido: it's the same as all the other diagonalization arguments
+2011-04-20.txt:21:48:01: <crystal-cola> If e : N -> (N -> N) is an evaluator and for every function f : N -> N suppose there was a code c : N such that e c = f then let f n = e n n + 1 and x be the code for f then f x = e x x + 1 = f x + 1
+2011-04-20.txt:21:48:05: <crystal-cola> therefore 0 = 1
+2011-04-20.txt:21:48:40: <crystal-cola> this is standard diagonalization argument like Turin
+2011-04-20.txt:21:48:42: <crystal-cola> g
+2011-04-20.txt:21:50:26: <crystal-cola> I guess mathematical proof is not enough to convince you
+2011-04-20.txt:21:51:26: <crystal-cola> exponentiation isn't total
+2011-04-20.txt:21:52:12: <crystal-cola> it grows too fast
+2011-04-20.txt:21:52:25: <crystal-cola> there is no evidece that numbers bigger than 1000000000000 can be exponentiated
+2011-04-20.txt:21:53:04: <crystal-cola> logic is relevant to this actually
+2011-04-20.txt:21:53:17: <crystal-cola> using logic one finds evidence that exponentiation is different
+2011-04-20.txt:21:53:52: <crystal-cola> There is no reason anything should be justified
+2011-04-20.txt:21:56:07: <crystal-cola> yeah
+2011-04-21.txt:11:33:15: <crystal-cola> multiparadigm programming has failed.
+2011-04-21.txt:11:33:22: <crystal-cola> Internet chatrooms are virtual meeting places where attitudes are shared, strengthened and validated.  In some channels, hackers of hate can sow misinformation about the plight of programmers elsewhere.  In our communities, groups and organisations led by young, dynamic innovators promote separatism by encouraging programmers to define themselves solely in terms of their language.
+2011-04-21.txt:11:35:36: <crystal-cola> So, let me end with this. This terrorism is completely indiscriminate and has been thrust upon us.  It cannot be ignored or contained; we have to confront it with confidence – confront the ideology that drives it by defeating the ideas that warp so many young minds at their root, and confront the issues of identity that sustain it by standing for a much broader and generous vision of programmers in our servers.
+2011-04-21.txt:11:36:26: <crystal-cola> Now, none of this will be easy.  We will need stamina, patience and SICP, and it won’t happen at all if we act alone.  This ideology crosses not just our continent but all continents, and we are all in this together.  At stake are not just algorithms, it is our way of expressing algorithms.  That is why this is a challenge we cannot avoid; it is one we must rise to and overcome.  Thank you.
+2011-04-21.txt:11:44:33: <crystal-cola> elliott: Une société qui s’écroule, une économie qui régresse, des appels à toujours plus de contrôles politiques pour juguler ce déclin, la situation actuelle a un goût de déjà-vu. Bien sûr on pense à la crise 1929. Mais c’est en fait à un livre - et désormais un film - qu’il est fait référence ici. Il s’agit d’Atlas Shrugged (la révolte d'Atlas) de la philosophe russo-américaine Ayn Rand, publié en 1957. Ce 
+2011-04-21.txt:11:52:58: <crystal-cola> Gauss shaves both himself and Bertrand Russell.
+2011-04-21.txt:11:53:58: <crystal-cola> For Gauss, correlation implies causation.
+2011-04-21.txt:11:54:34: <crystal-cola> Gauss can trisect an angle with a straightedge and compass.
+2011-04-21.txt:11:57:38: <crystal-cola> A Malament–Hogarth (M-H) spacetime, named after David B. Malament and Mark Hogarth, is a relativistic spacetime that possesses the following property: there exists a worldline λ and an event p such that all events along λ are a finite interval in the past of p, but the proper time along λ is infinite
+2011-04-21.txt:11:57:51: <crystal-cola> The significance of M-H spacetimes is that they allow for the implementation of certain non-Turing computable tasks (hypercomputation). The idea is for an observer at some event in p's past to set a computer (Turing machine) to work on some task and then have the Turing machine travel on λ, computing for all eternity. Since λ lies in p's past, the Turing machine can signal (a solution) to p at any stage of this never-ending task. Meanwhi
+2011-04-21.txt:11:57:58: <crystal-cola> The set-up can be used to decide the halting problem
+2011-04-21.txt:11:59:39: <crystal-cola> ?
+2011-04-21.txt:12:01:57: <crystal-cola> I wonder if you guys are being boring on purpose to make me go away
+2011-04-21.txt:12:03:28: <crystal-cola> idk I was trying to raise some topic for discussion
+2011-04-21.txt:12:06:11: <crystal-cola> lol
+2011-04-21.txt:12:06:21: <crystal-cola> I thought you were really into Ayn Rand
+2011-04-21.txt:14:37:03: <crystal-cola> okay I am putting hoover on igonre
+2011-04-21.txt:14:37:54: <crystal-cola> the reason people say ayn rand is so rubbish is because they are scared of her ideas taking hold
+2011-04-21.txt:14:39:26: <crystal-cola> no
+2011-04-21.txt:14:42:58: <crystal-cola> misogeny
+2011-04-21.txt:14:43:18: <crystal-cola> that's a sexist spelling
+2011-04-21.txt:14:43:37: <crystal-cola> mysogeny
+2011-04-21.txt:14:43:46: <crystal-cola> wymen
+2011-04-21.txt:14:43:47: <crystal-cola> etc.
+2011-04-21.txt:14:45:04: <crystal-cola> See Miller, Casey, Swift - The Handbook of Non-Sexist Language
+2011-04-21.txt:14:46:14: <oklopol> "<crystal-cola> oklopol: Nothing is more demeaning to a women than a ``bisexual'' mans distaste and fundamental non-acceptance of her femininity"
+2011-04-21.txt:14:47:07: <Sgeo__> 10:30:43 <crystal-cola> see here http://www.mit.edu/~thistle/v9/9.06/4bisexuality.html
+2011-04-21.txt:14:48:02: <crystal-cola> lol
+2011-04-21.txt:14:48:14: <crystal-cola> elliott: good point
+2011-04-21.txt:14:50:39: <crystal-cola> it's subjective
+2011-04-21.txt:14:51:01: <crystal-cola> gynder
+2011-04-21.txt:14:53:52: <crystal-cola> hitler is a fictional person
+2011-04-21.txt:14:53:54: <crystal-cola> he never existed
+2011-04-21.txt:14:59:54: <crystal-cola> im wondering if hoover is gonna stop being a dick?
+2011-04-21.txt:15:00:28: <crystal-cola> elliott: he was being to me
+2011-04-21.txt:15:00:47: <crystal-cola> oh now you are being a dick too
+2011-04-21.txt:15:01:16: <crystal-cola> shouldn't have brought it up, ill just put him back on ignore and leave it
+2011-04-21.txt:15:01:39: <crystal-cola> you said that being a dick to me is not being a dick
+2011-04-21.txt:15:01:48: <crystal-cola> that's how I interpreted it
+2011-04-21.txt:15:02:26: <crystal-cola> anyway I've stopped ``trolling''
+2011-04-21.txt:15:02:44: <crystal-cola> since apparently you guys don't like me claiming obviously false and absurd claims
+2011-04-21.txt:15:03:03: <crystal-cola> answer what?
+2011-04-21.txt:15:03:27: <elliott> `addquote <crystal-cola> anyway I've stopped ``trolling''  <crystal-cola> since apparently you guys don't like me claiming obviously false and absurd claims
+2011-04-21.txt:15:03:28: <HackEgo> 374) <crystal-cola> anyway I've stopped ``trolling''  <crystal-cola> since apparently you guys don't like me claiming obviously false and absurd claims
+2011-04-21.txt:15:03:30: <oklopol> "<crystal-cola> oklopol: Nothing is more demeaning to a women than a ``bisexual'' mans distaste and fundamental non-acceptance of her femininity" <<< can you translate this to a language?
+2011-04-21.txt:15:03:53: <crystal-cola> oklopol: it's (blatantly) bullshit
+2011-04-21.txt:15:04:52: <crystal-cola> what is what?
+2011-04-21.txt:15:05:07: <crystal-cola> the quote oklopol pasted
+2011-04-21.txt:15:05:32: <crystal-cola> it's just a bunch of garbage some idiot came up with to try to justify a false viewpoint they were entertaining
+2011-04-21.txt:15:06:35: <crystal-cola> what do you mean by "a language?"?
+2011-04-21.txt:15:07:09: <crystal-cola> I don't think there's any meaning there
+2011-04-21.txt:15:08:00: <crystal-cola> you can obviously try to invent some yourself - that's the main reason people say stuff that doesn't mean anything
+2011-04-21.txt:15:11:08: <crystal-cola> A starting point might be to speak in abstract syntax rather than text
+2011-04-21.txt:15:15:35: <crystal-cola> so any good projects on the go?
+2011-04-21.txt:15:15:54: <crystal-cola> like what
+2011-04-21.txt:15:16:02: <crystal-cola> I learned a bit about algebraic topology
+2011-04-21.txt:15:16:21: <crystal-cola> what does the number of bytes mean?
+2011-04-21.txt:15:16:49: <crystal-cola> oh that's cool
+2011-04-21.txt:15:17:27: <crystal-cola> I don't know the terminology about automatons
+2011-04-21.txt:15:19:18: <crystal-cola> it seems like a good idea but the proofs are horrible
+2011-04-21.txt:15:19:26: <crystal-cola> I think it's because the book I looked at sucks
+2011-04-21.txt:15:19:59: <crystal-cola> I don't know what you mean? I typed out a bunch of shit then deleted it
+2011-04-21.txt:15:20:28: <crystal-cola> it's useless
+2011-04-21.txt:15:20:39: <crystal-cola> I learned about cones and direct limits though
+2011-04-21.txt:15:21:16: <crystal-cola> you should put lots of old code you've written up on the web
+2011-04-21.txt:15:23:03: <crystal-cola> oklopol: so there is a characterization for linear ones already?
+2011-04-21.txt:15:23:34: <crystal-cola> wwhat sort of description is it?
+2011-04-21.txt:15:24:51: <crystal-cola> did you write a paper on it?
+2011-04-21.txt:15:26:01: <crystal-cola> okay
+2011-04-21.txt:15:27:20: <crystal-cola> wow
+2011-04-21.txt:15:28:28: <crystal-cola> Wow a complexity class that isn't mentioned on complexity zoo
+2011-04-21.txt:15:29:05: <crystal-cola> What is FNFA?
+2011-04-21.txt:15:30:59: <crystal-cola> why are they equivalent?
+2011-04-21.txt:15:31:29: <crystal-cola> ok
+2011-04-21.txt:15:34:21: <crystal-cola> it must feel good proving a theorem nobody proved before
+2011-04-21.txt:15:36:08: <crystal-cola> that reminds me ...  I wonder if Knuths new book is good
+2011-04-21.txt:15:36:19: <crystal-cola> it sounded kind of interesting
+2011-04-21.txt:15:45:19: <crystal-cola> ###wwww###
+2011-04-21.txt:15:45:24: <crystal-cola> #  wwww  #
+2011-04-21.txt:15:45:25: <crystal-cola> #  wwww  #
+2011-04-21.txt:15:45:27: <crystal-cola> ###wwww###
+2011-04-21.txt:15:45:33: <crystal-cola> # is dirt and w is water
+2011-04-21.txt:15:45:41: <crystal-cola> oh the last line should have been ##########
+2011-04-21.txt:15:45:49: <crystal-cola> you can build a house like that
+2011-04-21.txt:15:46:06: <crystal-cola> GUYS
+2011-04-21.txt:15:46:08: <crystal-cola> GUYS
+2011-04-21.txt:15:46:36: <crystal-cola> you can build an under-lake house
+2011-04-21.txt:15:50:41: <crystal-cola> arrows are dangeous
+2011-04-21.txt:15:51:14: <crystal-cola> oklopol: listen if you get hit by arrows you can die
+2011-04-21.txt:15:52:13: <crystal-cola> raining in minecraft??
+2011-04-21.txt:15:52:39: <crystal-cola> I was upset when they stopped wood from burning infinitely
+2011-04-21.txt:15:52:49: <crystal-cola> because that was a great party zone for free bacon
+2011-04-21.txt:15:53:33: <crystal-cola> u'u
+2011-04-21.txt:15:53:34: <crystal-cola> lol
+2011-04-21.txt:15:54:36: <crystal-cola> URGH
+2011-04-21.txt:15:54:41: <crystal-cola> how do I turn off "Acheivement get!"
+2011-04-21.txt:15:55:19: <crystal-cola> I hate it
+2011-04-21.txt:15:55:31: <crystal-cola> not me :/
+2011-04-21.txt:16:25:29: <crystal-cola> it's true and disappointing
+2011-04-21.txt:16:25:57: <crystal-cola> internet had potential to be so good
+2011-04-21.txt:16:26:17: <crystal-cola> now it's all just "download transformes II and mean girls" holywood movies
+2011-04-21.txt:16:27:54: <crystal-cola> why isn't there a website (or whatever) for people that want to learn stuff?
+2011-04-21.txt:16:28:16: <crystal-cola> if I want to learn quantum mechanics (for example) why can't I find a group of people that also want to? Using the internet
+2011-04-21.txt:16:48:02: <crystal-cola> ugh why are people so stupid
+2011-04-21.txt:16:48:06: <crystal-cola> everything is extremely simple
+2011-04-21.txt:16:48:34: <crystal-cola> this guy is asking how to prove a theorem that he doesn't even know how to state
+2011-04-21.txt:16:48:42: <crystal-cola> maybe that's why you can prove it ..?
+2011-04-21.txt:18:08:50: <crystal-cola> ##categorytheory - most boring channel ever
+2011-04-21.txt:18:14:30: <crystal-cola> im watching this guys videos about how angles and stuff are wrong
+2011-04-21.txt:18:14:51: <crystal-cola> http://web.maths.unsw.edu.au/~norman/views2.htm
+2011-04-21.txt:18:15:55: <crystal-cola> heh
+2011-04-21.txt:18:16:18: <crystal-cola> yeah anti-axiomatics is kind of a cool view
+2011-04-21.txt:18:17:28: <crystal-cola> every does math based on axioms, or at least they think they are doing so
+2011-04-21.txt:18:18:18: <crystal-cola> hehe
+2011-04-21.txt:18:19:59: <crystal-cola> he has some good points abuot angles
+2011-04-21.txt:18:20:09: <crystal-cola> you can basically do trigonometry without calculus
+2011-04-21.txt:18:20:14: <crystal-cola> so why not do that?
+2011-04-21.txt:18:21:28: <crystal-cola> I mean normal things like angles and trigonometry can only be rigorously done in terms of calculus
+2011-04-21.txt:18:21:41: <crystal-cola> but you usally learn these things before learning enough calculus to justify them
+2011-04-21.txt:18:22:00: <crystal-cola> so if you are going to do trigonometry at all why do it in that way? Since there is an easier way
+2011-04-21.txt:18:22:12: <crystal-cola> one that isn't founded on more advanced mathematics
+2011-04-21.txt:18:22:38: <crystal-cola> both can be made completely rigorous
+2011-04-21.txt:18:22:49: <crystal-cola> the only difference is how much work it takes
+2011-04-21.txt:18:23:42: <oklopol> "<crystal-cola> you can basically do trigonometry without calculus" <<< because it's no fun
+2011-04-21.txt:18:25:17: <crystal-cola> oklopol: ??
+2011-04-21.txt:18:26:40: <crystal-cola> what do you mean oklopol
+2011-04-21.txt:18:26:56: <crystal-cola> 19:24 < oklopol> crystal-cola: another difference is you're not doing math, eventually you  might disagree with someone.
+2011-04-21.txt:18:27:05: <crystal-cola> are you talking about axiom-free mathematics?
+2011-04-21.txt:18:27:30: <crystal-cola> people can disagree... if at least one of them is wrong
+2011-04-21.txt:18:29:01: <crystal-cola> elliott: why do you always talk about finitism?
+2011-04-21.txt:18:29:18: <crystal-cola> you always talk about it
+2011-04-21.txt:18:29:26: <crystal-cola> yes you do
+2011-04-21.txt:18:29:46: <crystal-cola> check the logs if you don't remember
+2011-04-21.txt:18:30:30: <crystal-cola> elliott: You talk about finitism all the time, I wonder why because you're obviously not actually a finitist
+2011-04-21.txt:18:30:39: <crystal-cola> elliott: Basically you're trolling. Why do you keep doing it?
+2011-04-21.txt:18:31:23: <crystal-cola> 14:19:52 <elliott> I'm starting the Order of Ultrafinitist Programmers, we code exclusively in lookup tables
+2011-04-21.txt:18:31:26: <crystal-cola> yesterday
+2011-04-21.txt:18:31:34: <crystal-cola> You brought up finitism
+2011-04-21.txt:18:31:46: <crystal-cola> elliott: because I proved you wrong? Okay
+2011-04-21.txt:18:32:34: <crystal-cola> elliott: People are having a serious discussion about metamathematics. Stop telling me off for not doing anything wrong and trolling about finitism and just generally being an ass.
+2011-04-21.txt:18:35:13: <crystal-cola> elliott: wrong
+2011-04-21.txt:18:36:58: <crystal-cola> what
+2011-04-21.txt:18:37:15: <crystal-cola> okay I'll /ignore you too
+2011-04-21.txt:18:37:24: <crystal-cola> stops us arguing as a bonus
+2011-04-21.txt:18:53:57: <crystal-cola> I never got introduced to anything rigorous in my math courses
+2011-04-21.txt:18:54:19: <crystal-cola> which is fine, I am able to supply my own rigor
+2011-04-21.txt:18:54:32: <crystal-cola> but I do think "normal" students cannot
+2011-04-21.txt:18:56:00: <crystal-cola> oklopol: Nobody ever taught me what a function was
+2011-04-21.txt:18:56:22: <crystal-cola> oklopol: I think you are very lucky to have been taught things properly - I am a sample of 1 but I don't think it's normal
+2011-04-21.txt:19:01:56: <crystal-cola> that was weird
+2011-04-21.txt:19:02:03: <crystal-cola> someone disagreed with me in #haskell and I didn't get banned
+2011-04-21.txt:19:03:16: <crystal-cola> oklopol: yeah seriously I think you just go to an exceptionally good university
+2011-04-21.txt:19:03:26: <crystal-cola> normally none of this stuff gets talked about
+2011-04-21.txt:19:06:32: <crystal-cola> it doesn't really matter how math is taught
+2011-04-21.txt:19:06:43: <crystal-cola> if you're smart you'll probably prove good theorems no matter what
+2011-04-21.txt:19:13:34: <crystal-cola> category of finite sets
+2011-04-21.txt:19:14:10: <crystal-cola> that definition of infinite set works without choice
+2011-04-21.txt:19:15:56: <crystal-cola> anyway axiom-free mathematics is to just brush aside since axiomatization is "solved". Look at Eulers papers
+2011-04-21.txt:19:20:01: <crystal-cola> "subsets of N" is a difficult notionn
+2011-04-21.txt:19:20:27: <crystal-cola> consider permutations of N, is a subset of N just the first n elements of a permutation?
+2011-04-21.txt:19:21:35: <crystal-cola> well even in the finite case it's awkward becuase of "wild" permutations
+2011-04-21.txt:19:23:16: <crystal-cola> http://qchu.wordpress.com/2009/11/05/i-dont-trust-uncountable-sets/
+2011-04-21.txt:19:27:17: <crystal-cola> I guess one of the difficulties is, let S be a subset of N then consider the obvious bijection 1 -> first element of S, 2 -> second element, ...
+2011-04-21.txt:19:27:32: <crystal-cola> almost all infinite sets S lead to functions that grow so fast...
+2011-04-21.txt:19:27:44: <crystal-cola> much faster than busy beaver
+2011-04-21.txt:19:28:16: <crystal-cola> fast growing functions are a bitch, ever studied logic?
+2011-04-21.txt:19:28:52: <crystal-cola> they're just really difficult
+2011-04-21.txt:19:29:09: <crystal-cola> the rate of growth of a function is the sort of thing you need stronger and stronger axioms to deal tih
+2011-04-21.txt:19:29:12: <crystal-cola> with
+2011-04-21.txt:19:29:43: <crystal-cola> like you can't prove ackermann terminates in weak logics.. you need something extra
+2011-04-21.txt:19:29:52: <crystal-cola> and the same phenomenon happens all the time throughout
+2011-04-21.txt:19:30:34: <crystal-cola> yeah that's true
+2011-04-21.txt:19:30:50: <crystal-cola> I'm not saying I can prove false with this, I know it all works out fine in ZFC
+2011-04-21.txt:19:33:05: <crystal-cola> hehe
+2011-04-21.txt:19:34:11: <crystal-cola> it's non-trivial that they are independent
+2011-04-21.txt:19:34:13: <crystal-cola> for a star
+2011-04-21.txt:19:34:14: <crystal-cola> t
+2011-04-21.txt:19:34:23: <crystal-cola> and their proof theoretic strength is also quite high
+2011-04-21.txt:19:34:38: <crystal-cola> there is a lot up with them
+2011-04-21.txt:19:35:55: <crystal-cola> well personally I ahve no trouble using them
+2011-04-21.txt:19:36:16: <crystal-cola> I don't know about others, I wouldn't claim everyone else finds them hard but I wouldn't be surprised
+2011-04-21.txt:19:36:23: <crystal-cola> people have trouble learning the axioms of group theory...
+2011-04-21.txt:19:38:11: <crystal-cola> why is that confusing?
+2011-04-21.txt:19:40:03: <crystal-cola> impomatic: int main(int argc, char** argv)
+2011-04-21.txt:19:40:10: <crystal-cola> impomatic: and return EXIT_SUCCESS;
+2011-04-21.txt:19:42:20: <crystal-cola> impomatic: I think you need to check if scanf worked
+2011-04-21.txt:19:52:50: <crystal-cola> oklopol: that bit is weird, it's trivial to show that stuff corrrect... you just need a single non-constructive step (checking if a real number is zero or not)
+2011-04-21.txt:19:53:02: <crystal-cola> for division
+2011-04-21.txt:19:53:21: <crystal-cola> oklopol: so not sure what is meant by that paragraph..
+2011-04-21.txt:19:57:58: <crystal-cola> that's a subtle one
+2011-04-21.txt:19:58:18: <crystal-cola> The computable reals are countable if you consider them as computter programs
+2011-04-21.txt:19:58:26: <crystal-cola> but cantors diagonalization still works
+2011-04-21.txt:19:58:37: <crystal-cola> so it all depends if you're "inside" or "outside" the theory
+2011-04-21.txt:19:59:34: <crystal-cola> heh
+2011-04-22.txt:12:48:48: <crystal-cola> marsh mallows are sugar and egg white
+2011-04-22.txt:12:48:52: <crystal-cola> well
+2011-04-22.txt:12:49:02: <crystal-cola> the stuff you buy in shops is probably synthesized from cow brains
+2011-04-22.txt:12:49:10: <crystal-cola> but you can make them from sugar and egg white
+2011-04-22.txt:13:50:45: <crystal-cola> show that x^15 + y^3 = 34^34 has no integer solutions
+2011-04-22.txt:14:00:29: <crystal-cola> :D
+2011-04-22.txt:14:01:01: <crystal-cola> wnat do you think of diophantine ?
+2011-04-22.txt:14:12:20: <crystal-cola> Find all m,n such that 3^m - 2^n = +/- 1
+2011-04-22.txt:14:16:31: <crystal-cola> diophantine equations with unsigned chars
+2011-04-22.txt:14:16:36: <crystal-cola>  you can check every case
+2011-04-22.txt:14:17:45: <crystal-cola> Sgeo: ...
+2011-04-22.txt:14:19:02: <crystal-cola> Sgeo: I don't think that can be solved by elementry methods
+2011-04-22.txt:14:20:31: <crystal-cola> x^n + y^n = z^n => xyz = 0
+2011-04-22.txt:14:22:06: <crystal-cola> haha that's clever
+2011-04-22.txt:14:22:11: <crystal-cola> is is true for the negative n?
+2011-04-22.txt:14:22:14: <crystal-cola> I don't konw about that
+2011-04-22.txt:14:22:54: <crystal-cola> (yz)^n + (xz)^n = (xy)^n
+2011-04-22.txt:14:23:17: <crystal-cola> okay what about n = -2
+2011-04-22.txt:14:23:20: <crystal-cola> and -1
+2011-04-22.txt:14:23:28: <crystal-cola> 1/x + 1/y = 1/z
+2011-04-22.txt:14:23:33: <crystal-cola> 1/x^2 + 1/y^2 = 1/z^2
+2011-04-22.txt:14:23:47: <crystal-cola> I will ask the egyptians
+2011-04-22.txt:14:27:54: <crystal-cola> How do you find all solutions?
+2011-04-22.txt:14:49:34: <crystal-cola> hey check this out
+2011-04-22.txt:14:49:52: <crystal-cola> a(1)=1;a(n+1)=2n+1-a(a(n-1))
+[too many lines; stopping]