2003-01-25.txt:13:58:54: <Speuler> this may be the space for my future project :)
2003-02-06.txt:19:52:09: <exarkun> Funge is arbitrary-dimensional though, over an unbounded space
2003-02-07.txt:05:02:57: <dbc> Well, they usually put one number per line. Though they may go to the next line if they run out of space...
2003-06-18.txt:08:32:01: -!- lament has quit ("http://www.cyberspace.org/~lament").
2003-07-09.txt:04:12:47: <dbc> By common usage, lots of things count as "programming languages" that aren't Turing-complete even if you neglect the unlimitedspace requirement.
2003-07-11.txt:03:26:49: -!- lament changed the topic of #esoteric to: http://cyberspace.org/~lament/abuse.html
2003-07-13.txt:19:36:46: <lament> Hopefully cyberspace.org goes back up.
2003-07-17.txt:05:13:38: <lament> The language has significant whitespace and statements are terminated by a blank line.
2003-07-29.txt:23:57:06: <Taaus> I know what you mean. Significant whitespace.
2003-08-01.txt:00:45:01: <Taaus> I stumbled across a 3d version of a Thue-ish language... A Japanese program... Someone had implemented space invaders in it :)
2003-08-05.txt:20:54:41: <lament> http://cyberspace.org/~lament/thue.html
2003-08-05.txt:20:55:02: -!- lament changed the topic of #esoteric to: http://cyberspace.org/~lament/thue.html - Instructions on the bottom of the can
2003-08-11.txt:19:25:47: -!- sterling.freenode.net changed the topic of #esoteric to: http://cyberspace.org/~lament/thue.html - Instructions on the bottom of the can
2003-12-12.txt:21:03:16: <fizzie> 2135 is even better byte ordering - saves 20% of memory space.
2004-02-08.txt:21:21:03: <Toreun> fizzie: ... but you could just add whitespace on the sides of the source to make it bigger
2004-02-11.txt:00:21:13: <mooz-> no, but it wastes space :)
2004-04-29.txt:06:21:50: <andretwo> hm where should i position it... top-left on the blank space, or merge it with the fishbone bottom-right?
2004-04-30.txt:07:43:57: <andreou> anyone good with webdesign? i can provide the space and scripts, but i really can't put two and two bits together when it comes to gfx :)
2004-05-01.txt:04:11:44: <heatsink> Also, you need a space between the b and the d
2004-05-04.txt:02:56:55: <andreou> that mod has a lot of blank space :)
2004-05-04.txt:03:01:50: <Toreun> it's the standard spacefilling text
2004-05-04.txt:03:53:42: <Toreun> I would offer my server as webspace, but I'm afraid it's so unreliable it wouldn't be much good
2004-05-04.txt:04:00:35: <Toreun> it's just to fill space
2004-05-06.txt:02:03:41: <heatsink> I want to be able to have successive lines of text spaced by successive prime-number distances
2004-05-27.txt:16:10:22: <fizzie> oh, and the playfield was redefined from the older "80x25-unit torus-grid" to "infinite lahey-space"
2004-05-27.txt:22:12:54: <fizzie> of course soldering stuff into a pre-made pcb with ~1cm empty spaces between stuff I could accidentally mess up I managed to do.
2004-05-27.txt:23:03:58: <lament> fizzie: sure, but you need 10 bits to address a space of 1024 addresses
2004-05-28.txt:20:20:38: <calamari_> the way I did the operators was reading 2 characters at a time, then checking in a string like this "++--+ - (etc)" it will find a match with 2 chars before a match with one.. it recognizes the space as a wildcard
2004-05-28.txt:20:23:15: <calamari_> with spaces it will do a++ + ++b 
2004-06-10.txt:20:53:12: <lament> infinite memory space
2004-06-10.txt:20:54:01: <calamari_> lament: if you have infinit memory space what do you do about something like +[>+] ?
2004-06-10.txt:21:05:31: <calamari_> taaus: that was with a finite memory space
2004-06-10.txt:21:05:46: <lament> calamari_: obviously you can't do it with infinite memory space.
2004-06-10.txt:21:06:04: <calamari_> lament: "<lament> infinite memory space"
2004-06-10.txt:21:06:43: <calamari_> with finite space +[>+] this eventually exits
2004-06-12.txt:09:41:18: <fizzie> (2) Research, design, development, production or use of rocket systems, space launch vehicles, sounding rockets, missles, drones, or unmanned air vehicle systems.
2004-06-15.txt:17:22:17: <fizzie> but to have enough disk space to backup my previous /etc, /usr and /var directories I probably need to burn random stuff on dvds.
2004-06-27.txt:03:38:57: <calamari_> space hd .. space hard drive.. hard drive space?  are you worried about your hard drive space?
2004-06-28.txt:17:00:47: <calamari_> 3 letter instruction..  operands  (spaces or tabs are ignored)
2004-06-29.txt:17:57:06: <lament> your memory space might also be infinite
2004-07-31.txt:22:37:49: <Keymaker> space invaders rule!!
2004-09-23.txt:19:50:02: <ZeroOne> fizzie: "radix of n-dimensional space, sort of. unambiguous coordinates etc."
2004-10-05.txt:22:23:01: <ZeroOne> Hipo: like Brainfuck, Befunge, Whitespace, INTERCAL, Unlambda, ...
2004-11-07.txt:22:35:37: <fizzie> me will probably try to sleep some now, have that mat-1.403 exam tomorrow. infinite-dimensional vector spaces, path integrals of complex functions using residues, QR factorizations of matrices. yay!
2004-12-23.txt:09:13:13: <calamari-> nah.. floppy doesn't need anything that complicated.  In fact, the whole os could probably fit in the space of the bootloader
2004-12-23.txt:09:25:36: <calamari-> this is like a com file where you only have a little over 400 bytes of code space
2004-12-23.txt:09:27:17: <calamari-> usually this code space is used to load a larger program from disk and run it (what's why it's called the boot sector, lifting yourself up by the bootstraps and all that)
2004-12-26.txt:12:52:04: <nooga_> code space, output window and stack listener :)
2004-12-27.txt:18:47:40: <Keymaker> maybe i should buy some webspace for bf
2004-12-27.txt:18:48:23: <Keymaker> i wouldn't need php support or much space,
2004-12-27.txt:18:49:58: <ZeroOne> don't you get any webspace from your ISP?
2004-12-27.txt:19:04:44: <ZeroOne> I'm hooked to mbnet because of the homepage space and the email address
2004-12-27.txt:19:05:20: <ZeroOne> the homepage space is namely 50 MB but in fact there are no limits ;o
2004-12-27.txt:19:05:39: <lindi-> i have my 'homepage' on a friends box with gigabytes of space ;)
2004-12-28.txt:17:05:04: <calamari_> essentially what is needed is a bf where there is memory access to the code space
2004-12-29.txt:20:32:25: <calamari_> for example 00h 008h (because then you get the printed backspace as a bonus)
2005-01-03.txt:22:41:45: <ZeroOne> Keymaker: http://f2g.net/ looks like a promising free web host. 15 MB space, no ads, short subdomain address, SSI, email, FTP, statistics. :o
2005-01-28.txt:23:52:05: <Keymaker> since i don't have any space yet
2005-02-05.txt:22:20:34: <Keymaker> it could be clever to use space character (asc 32) as 'instruction character' and return/enter (asc 10) as 'execution character'
2005-02-05.txt:23:05:01: <fizzie> There is already a language that uses only whitespace as its syntax.
2005-02-05.txt:23:05:22: <Keymaker> it's called "Whitespace" :p
2005-02-10.txt:05:06:37: <arke> instead of ! and ?, use newline and space
2005-02-10.txt:05:15:37: <calamari> there is a language called whitespace .. ;)
2005-02-25.txt:00:49:09: <arke> Rogue: basically brainfuck. However, theres 2 instructions, one of them you scroll through a circular lists of brainfuck instructions, the next one executes that brainfuck instruction. after executing, it scrolls to the next brainfuck instruction. the character for scroll is space and the character for execute is enter/return/newline
2005-03-03.txt:20:59:01: <{^Raven^}> would make space-invaders difficult
2005-03-05.txt:13:35:29: <{^Raven^}> how much server space/bandwidth would you need?
2005-03-05.txt:13:36:12: <{^Raven^}> how much file space?
2005-03-06.txt:02:33:23: <cpressey> i worry that calamari's boot block doesn't have enough space left in it to parse a bank number :)
2005-03-11.txt:04:09:06: <{^Raven^}> it's no fun if the space invaders wait for you to press a key
2005-03-11.txt:04:51:28: <{^Raven^}> i wrote space invaders for mine before it was burgled
2005-03-11.txt:18:19:45: <kipple> The whitespace language is nice for steganography :)
2005-03-17.txt:14:53:34: <Keymaker> remember that this takes a lot space; i have a feeling my code will be at least 1000+
2005-03-18.txt:20:04:54: <calamari> you don't need locate.. can just print spaces then use backspace
2005-03-30.txt:14:09:23: <matricks> Fungus-98 defines a 32bit working space
2005-05-03.txt:02:57:28: <GregorR> Does anybody want to try out my combination of BrainFuck and CoreWars?  Essentially, you have two BrainFuckish programs running concurrently, and their data space is the opponent's program space.
2005-05-03.txt:15:40:50: <Keymaker> do you have the language specification uploaded anywhere as txt, because sourceforge board removes spaces
2005-05-04.txt:15:57:22: <GregorR> So it sticks the two chunks of code at opposite ends of the same program space and they go towards eachother?  (Or still different program space?)
2005-05-04.txt:19:17:28: <pgimeno> a space is a nop, then?
2005-05-04.txt:20:00:13: <Keymaker> for the sake of simplicity there should be language using only space and new-line :)
2005-05-04.txt:20:00:49: <pgimeno> that's Whitespace, not to be confused with Blank :)
2005-05-04.txt:20:02:06: <pgimeno> Blank is not about spaces, I think
2005-05-05.txt:08:02:47: <Keymaker> btw, so there's "infinite" space on right side?
2005-05-05.txt:12:38:29: <fizzie> fis@colin:~/prog/eclipse-workspace/misc$ java -cp . org.gehennom.misc.BFRE 'a(a|b)*b|b(a|b)*a' > ~/prog/misc/brfd/re.bf
2005-05-05.txt:16:34:27: <GregorR> I own codu.org , but have very minimal space and bandwidth on my host there :-P
2005-05-06.txt:03:59:55: <GregorR-L> fizzie: Sorry I keep tossing stuff into the FYB web space, I promise that's the last one ;0
2005-05-06.txt:08:29:30: <GregorR> OK, OK: A language is turing complete IF given infinite memory and code space, it could solve any mathematical problem.  Is that a good all-inclusive definition?
2005-05-06.txt:21:03:43: <fizzie> I had some trouble fitting X11, opengl and that soft-synth in a 4K elf executable - or actually having any space left over to insert actual code in. :p
2005-05-06.txt:21:53:28: <KnX> i'm searching an efficient implementation for an arbitrary-dimentional funge-space in C, if someone has a good idea ...
2005-05-06.txt:22:54:01: <pgimeno> http://web.archive.org/web/20031210145310/http://cyberspace.org/~lament/thue.html
2005-05-09.txt:22:52:39: <KnX> could someone explain me why same-line wrapping is called lahey-space wrapping, i can't find doc about lahey-space except befunge-related ?
2005-05-10.txt:03:16:12: <GregorR-L> Crapsicles ... Kipple doesn't need to be space-delimited?
2005-05-10.txt:14:25:53: <Keymaker> probably space could be the traditional NOP there, like in befunge
2005-05-10.txt:14:30:05: <Keymaker> using space as blank and < > v ^ as direction characters
2005-05-10.txt:14:33:08: <Keymaker> and one for space
2005-05-10.txt:14:33:40: <kipple> what do you mean, for space?
2005-05-10.txt:14:34:19: <Keymaker> if the program is in 2d space the instructions can't be this way:
2005-05-10.txt:15:06:32: <KnX> for information , i decided to separate my befunge core from the funge-space, making a funge-space-librairy which could be usefull for many langages maybe ...
2005-05-10.txt:17:26:56: <Keymaker> this kind of language would take extremely much space but at least beat GregorR's 2L ;)
2005-05-11.txt:05:32:42: <calamari> whitespace vs whatever they like
2005-05-11.txt:22:56:38: <kipple> " It has the memory limited to 2 bits for space reasons"
2005-05-12.txt:19:42:34: <GregorR-L> Very small amount of space, low bandwidth, intermittent issues.
2005-05-12.txt:19:50:16: <pgimeno> there's funpic.org for example, unlimited space and php + mysql
2005-05-12.txt:19:51:34: <fizzie> Mm-hmm. I've sometimes considered buying some quality hosting space. A local-ish provider (nebula.fi) has this (1GB of space, php+stuff, 25GB/month traffic recommendation) service that'd be 15eur/month, but since I don't have any content to host, I probably won't do that until I have a Real Job or something.
2005-05-13.txt:08:57:37: <pgimeno> http://web.archive.org/web/20031210145310/http://cyberspace.org/~lament/thue.html
2005-05-13.txt:08:58:10: <lament> cyberspace.org
2005-05-13.txt:09:13:58: <lament> just look at http://web.archive.org/web/20031218155802/cyberspace.org/~lament/ instead
2005-05-21.txt:14:00:56: <kipple> maybe whitespace
2005-05-21.txt:14:01:19: <pgimeno> hm, whitespace is more like a humorous language
2005-05-21.txt:14:01:40: <CXI> whitespace is pretty well known
2005-05-21.txt:14:10:39: <pgimeno> I didn't know about the popularity of Whitespace; before I knew, I thought that it wasn't worth the inclusion
2005-05-21.txt:14:12:27: <kipple> Whitespace became quite known last year, so it's kind of a piece of internet history
2005-05-21.txt:14:13:56: <kipple> The main esolang article lists the following as "notable": Befunge, Brainfuck, False, INTERCAL, Malbolge, Shakespeare, Unlambda and Whitespace
2005-05-22.txt:01:05:07: <kipple> I dislike the wikis that can't have spaces in the links. but maybe that's just me
2005-05-22.txt:01:08:52: <calamari_> you can use spaces, actually
2005-05-22.txt:01:09:45: <calamari_> well, you're right.. the link dont have spaces, but the user doesn't know
2005-05-22.txt:07:43:55: <GregorR> Gregor's customized version of "Wiki!" supports guest posting and file uploads, and titles with spaces in them (which was supported anyway)
2005-05-22.txt:13:09:41: <pgimeno> you know, I thought that the name came instead from Sierra's Space Quest II adventure where there's a toy called Cubix Rube
2005-05-24.txt:22:01:50: <pgimeno> space growth can be a problem too, I don't know how MySQL handles that but I think it's the smartest in that sense
2005-05-24.txt:22:03:35: <malaprop> Space growth?
2005-05-26.txt:11:21:19: <calamari_> so far it has extremely primitive command line parsing (spaces only, no quotes or escapes).. but it does load and run each program.. they have their own main method
2005-05-26.txt:23:25:26: <graue> uploads are not in a page; they just wind up in a global namespace
2005-05-26.txt:23:30:50: <pgimeno> calamari: about namespace collision: say, hello.bf - is it a befunge program or a brainfuck program?
2005-05-26.txt:23:32:22: <pgimeno> graue: it was just an example of namespace collision :)
2005-05-27.txt:23:23:58: <Keymaker> (hopefully there is two spaces)
2005-05-28.txt:03:00:19: <graue> hmm, images of what? Piet programs? Whitespace with syntax highlighting?
2005-05-28.txt:03:05:13: <graue> check the wikipedia article for Whitespace
2005-05-28.txt:23:24:21: <lament> wouldn't it be nice for something like ibiblio to give us space
2005-05-28.txt:23:38:48: <graue> http://esoteric.voxelperfect.net/wiki/Whitespace
2005-05-29.txt:22:44:05: <jix> and it ignores spaces and 
 in input.. 
2005-05-29.txt:23:10:19: <jix> hm 99bob page: Use Whitespace, TABs and Returns to make your code readable.. is it ok to not use them ?
2005-05-30.txt:02:30:39: <graue> by the way, you technically have a third instruction: whitespace
2005-06-02.txt:15:31:22: <CXI> a program to take a list of inputs and outputs, and use some kind of state-space search over all possible programs to find a program that matches the inputs and outputs
2005-06-03.txt:17:06:33: <jix> now i'm going to add whitespace ;)
2005-06-04.txt:00:09:09: <graue> also, a whitespace interpreter, whitespace, is there
2005-06-04.txt:13:12:28: <kipple> ok. so how do you separate numbers? space? comma? semicolon? (is this missing from the spec, or am I blind?)
2005-06-04.txt:13:13:01: <graue> terms are separated by spaces
2005-06-04.txt:13:51:41: <kipple> hmm. I think I will allow ANY character as a stack name in the next version, except numbers, whitespace and #
2005-06-04.txt:19:35:26: <cpressey> it's like, being able to write 99 bottles of beer, in less space than writing out the song literally
2005-06-04.txt:20:17:56: <graue> meta stuff should be in the Esolang namespace since mediawiki likes it that way
2005-06-04.txt:22:01:17: <fizzie> "Computational complexity" reminds perhaps too much of time/space-complexity, which is really a different issue.
2005-06-04.txt:22:13:04: <fizzie> You could cheat and classify as Turing-complete all languages that are "turing-complete if not a simple memory space restriction of K, the changing of which would not change the language semantics _that_ much", but that's horribly unexact.
2005-06-05.txt:12:40:48: <jix> and no other syntax elements (no () no [] no white-spaces no {}...)
2005-06-05.txt:17:25:29: <pgimeno> "The replacement may contain the special character & to refer to that portion of the patter space which matched, and the special escapes 
 through \9 to refer to the corresponding matching sub-expressions in the regexp." (from the sed man page)
2005-06-06.txt:11:38:49: <pgimeno> actually it's a joke language to ironize about the lack of space for writing complex programs in some space-limited languages, especially Malbolge
2005-06-06.txt:21:44:22: <pgimeno> handy free webspace.
2005-06-06.txt:21:44:22: <pgimeno> own webspace one day, but not yet, so it's a good idea to make a copy.
2005-06-07.txt:01:14:19: <cpressey> i'm actually wondering if wireworld's unlimited space counts as "tape" or
2005-06-07.txt:01:17:56: <cpressey> if your "space" looks like this: http://pages.prodigy.net/nylesheise/langton_5.gif  you can make one of those Turmites
2005-06-07.txt:23:58:12: <lament> they're padded with whitespace at the end to make them of equal length
2005-06-09.txt:23:36:10: <malaprop> er, there should be a space between -C and -e
2005-06-10.txt:03:56:43: <graue> i wonder if it could be accommodated by creating a new namespace
2005-06-10.txt:04:00:17: <graue> i wonder if calamari would go for the "EsoShell:" namespace idea
2005-06-10.txt:04:01:55: <graue> short story: i think it would be cool if you did your java applet thing in a new namespace on the existing wiki
2005-06-10.txt:04:34:36: <calamari> any thoughts on how to wrap the filename and source?  need to think about 2d languages, whitespace.. etc :)  gotta run
2005-06-10.txt:10:46:02: <pgimeno> I think that graue's idea of a separate namespace is a nice solution for everyone
2005-06-10.txt:19:13:52: <calamari_> so, I'm curious.. how can we display a whitespace program on the wiki without using images?
2005-06-10.txt:19:14:39: <calamari_> I could invent some kind of escape code, but that wouldn't work well for a 2-d whitespace, if there is ever such a thing
2005-06-10.txt:19:18:45: <kipple> ah, you were talking about whitespace :)
2005-06-10.txt:19:40:23: <kipple> anybody know if whitespace it TC?
2005-06-10.txt:19:46:01: <GregorR> But a whitespace nterpreter should read: 
 - this must be a comment, ignore ... 
 - line break
2005-06-10.txt:19:47:39: <GregorR> It'll be CR-LF-PageB-tab-tab-space-lf
2005-06-10.txt:19:48:19: <GregorR> malaprop: From a UNIX-centric whitespace nterpreters standpoint, 
 = linebreak.
2005-06-10.txt:20:47:50: <pgimeno> I've been reading yesterday's log about the possibility of a separate namespace for EsoShell
2005-06-10.txt:23:24:19: <Keymaker> (less time, less space ;))
2005-06-13.txt:05:34:37: <calamari> argh.. my esoshell hacks for printed backspaces don't seem to be working right
2005-06-13.txt:18:04:55: <{^Raven^}> IMHO any current interpreter that allows a program to wander into arbitary workspace is horrificly broken
2005-06-15.txt:20:39:15: <CXI> specifically, my Whitlams CD and my copy of Freespace
2005-06-15.txt:20:40:42: <malaprop> CXI: If you want another copy of Freespace, ask me in a couple days when I'm home and I'll see if I have it to rip for you.
2005-06-16.txt:03:10:27: <calamari> but say you did something like A$=B$+C$.. it would take B$ and C$, determinae a new length for A$, and copy B$ and C$ into the space
2005-06-16.txt:03:28:29: <calamari> SPACE$ and STRING$ are nice too
2005-06-16.txt:05:49:02: <tokigun> it contains interpreter, assembler, disassembler of whitespace.
2005-06-19.txt:18:31:32: <Keymaker> (there should be 7 spaces at one place, i hope this opera chat didn't trim them..)
2005-06-19.txt:19:32:48: <jix> and you can fill any spaces in the code with 1s and 0s
2005-06-20.txt:18:20:42: -!- azurespace has joined #esoteric.
2005-06-20.txt:18:20:52: -!- azurespace has parted #esoteric (?).
2005-06-24.txt:23:07:20: <{^Raven^}> hmmm, the main problem is the trade off between the space gained by compression and the code size required for decompression
2005-06-25.txt:00:59:17: <cpressey> having an 8K data file is really a lot of space.  where's the challenge?
2005-06-25.txt:01:04:10: <cpressey> well... i mean, there still can be a challenge, but it's mostly the same as any other IF competition - just design and implement a good game.  10K is plenty of space to do that in, if you're any good at writing small code.
2005-06-25.txt:01:04:30: <cpressey> i guess the thing is, i'm running out of ideas, before i've run out of space.  heh
2005-06-28.txt:20:48:44: <jimbo00000> yea, totally - get that plugin running.  the pc leaves behind alpha scaled trails over the code space
2005-06-28.txt:20:52:56: <jimbo00000> up to 100 spaces back - gotta click the handle again if youre restarting
2005-06-28.txt:21:03:18: <jimbo00000> no, what you should see is a 80x25 textfield labeled "Funge Space"
2005-06-28.txt:22:16:01: <jimbo00000> I just had a wild idea - concurrent pcs in a 2d space executing choon, making chords possible
2005-06-29.txt:00:51:14: <calamari> I've been trying to set up mediawiki on my webspace, but have 4.0 
2005-06-29.txt:22:49:42: <lament> but to implement a turing machine, you need infinite space to put the tape in.
2005-06-29.txt:23:34:53: <cpressey> for wireworld, program space == data space, and it's unbounded.
2005-06-30.txt:21:01:19: <jix> and if you save wood and space you save water too
2005-06-30.txt:22:47:13: <calamari> Stork shares packages between clients on the machine, reducing disk space usage and possibly memory usage as well
2005-07-01.txt:00:03:15: <{^Raven^}> yeah, you can get free geocities space with a yahoo id, tripod does free hosting
2005-07-01.txt:19:01:46: <graue> you can eliminate wire crossing by using = and | as pipes, where if the IP is moving horizontally and hits | or vertically and hits =, the program ends, and if the IP moves into a blank space or anything else the program ends
2005-07-01.txt:19:36:03: <calamari> I need to ignore whitespace, and it should be fixed
2005-07-02.txt:01:12:48: <pgimeno> wouldn't a "nop" (space) be enough?
2005-07-02.txt:01:18:13: <pgimeno> yeah, but no need for # if a space is in the crosspoint
2005-07-03.txt:00:15:09: <Kmkr> if there is space before instruction, do i use '!'? like for example
2005-07-03.txt:00:20:43: <graue> what do you mean if there's space before an instruction?
2005-07-03.txt:00:20:56: <Kmkr> i mean if there is spaces
2005-07-03.txt:00:21:00: <graue> if a character doesn't get executed it can be anything (exclamation mark, space, etc)
2005-07-03.txt:00:23:14: <graue> it means your code left the rectangle of code space
2005-07-08.txt:23:10:02: <calamari> wow, this monospace 12 font makes 0 and O look identical.. usually one is rounder than the other, not this time
2005-07-09.txt:10:49:38: <tokigun> i want to use ubuntu linux but i doesn't have enough space
2005-07-10.txt:09:55:52: <tokigun> SFunge has two registers, infinite code space, and three 2D vector.
2005-07-10.txt:10:04:05: <tokigun> hmm hello world program reads "Hello, world!" string from its code space.
2005-07-10.txt:21:31:18: <pgimeno> single-register Minsky machines are very expensive in terms of wasted integer space AFAIK
2005-07-19.txt:18:47:37: <graue> what would 2L look like if all spaces were treated like +s, and all printing characters like *s, with no nop command?
2005-07-19.txt:18:51:04: <graue> think about it though, spaces are turns and only *s can actually be executed
2005-07-19.txt:22:39:47: <GregorR> If sizeof(void *) was infinite, you'd have infinite space to store sizeof(void *) :)
2005-07-19.txt:23:37:00: <graue> in the other two directions, spaces could be nops
2005-07-20.txt:17:22:41: <jix> 2L == a language with just 2 instruction (3 if you count space==nop)
2005-07-20.txt:17:23:50: <Keymaker> but probably the 1L needs two instructions..? or at least one instruction and some 'space'?
2005-07-20.txt:17:24:51: <jix> the .tr removes some space filling characters
2005-07-20.txt:17:25:20: <Aardwolf> So the whitespace is ignored?
2005-07-22.txt:09:12:45: <tokigun> it has two registers, and one vector(or pointer) to manipulate code space
2005-07-22.txt:09:31:12: <fizzie> Is there a fixed size for "space", or is it potentially-unlimited? 
2005-07-22.txt:09:39:21: <fizzie> "The cord space which stores the cord on the execution middle is composed of 2 dimension plane surface of the size which is infinite, to each unit the coordinate comes to give."
2005-07-22.txt:12:24:27: <tokigun> doesn't work. i think my irc client has whitespace problem (or somewhat)...
2005-07-22.txt:12:26:03: <tokigun> there is three spaces between 0| and 0~4+8... :)
2005-07-23.txt:05:59:42: <GregorR> Reallocate space
2005-07-23.txt:17:29:24: <fizzie> It prints out 8 spaces, it seems. :p
2005-07-23.txt:23:56:23: <Aardwolf> cool, my browser supports the monospaced Hangul font
2005-07-24.txt:21:56:17: <jix> i do some bf-space o11s ( [odd number of + or -] => z ; delete <>|><|+-|-+ and + or - in front of z)
2005-07-25.txt:21:02:16: <jix> ah just noted that there is still space for optimizations
2005-07-25.txt:22:52:38: <jix> i tried to compiler Lost Kingdom.. Out of stack space.
2005-07-26.txt:12:06:09: <Gs30ng> even space, tab, or newline
2005-07-26.txt:12:54:48: <Gs30ng> hey, we have a space for one more instruction
2005-07-26.txt:13:23:50: <jix> i just added the maximum move-up+1 and maximum move-down+1 to the border space of the memory 
2005-07-26.txt:15:59:45: <Gs30ng> so i think we must use UTF-8 system to guarantee enough memory space
2005-07-26.txt:16:28:18: <tokigun> i've make several obfuscated interpreter of whitespace and whirl in c... i like esoteric programming, but also obfuscated programming.
2005-07-26.txt:19:43:33: <Gs30ng> spaces are ignored?
2005-07-26.txt:19:43:53: <Keymaker> space is just another trigger
2005-07-27.txt:12:29:54: <int-e> sorry. I understood 'wrapping cells' to mean 'wrapping memory space' which I wouldn't like - but I see that's not what was meant now.
2005-07-28.txt:00:35:24: <int-e> oh, you added inderection and a very big address space, interesting
2005-07-28.txt:00:36:04: <Gs30ng> yes, very big address space
2005-07-28.txt:00:43:34: <Gs30ng> a limited source code can only use a limited memory space
2005-07-28.txt:01:03:52: <GregorR> Hmm, lemme think ... would it be Turing-complete if it was the code pointer?  You still couldn't access the entire bounds of memory from any location, and hence wouldn't have infinite storage space ...
2005-07-28.txt:01:06:32: <GregorR> The usual good-enough is "Turing-complete with the exception of finite storage space"
2005-07-28.txt:01:06:50: <GregorR> (So long as that finite space is enough to actually do anything)
2005-07-28.txt:01:09:27: <GregorR> Gs30ng: Olde UNIX joke - if yoshell doesn't allow you to delete, backspace becomes ^H
2005-07-28.txt:01:10:10: <lament> GregorR: and if it does, ^H becomes backspace
2005-07-28.txt:02:16:44: <Gs30ng> is there any wiki space for sample Udage codes?
2005-07-29.txt:21:46:47: <calamari> bios functions are very lame though, from a space standpoint.. have to set a lot of registers for even simpel tasks, so that wastes rom space
2005-07-29.txt:21:47:03: <jix> rom space?
2005-07-29.txt:21:47:19: <jix> ROM space?
2005-07-29.txt:21:51:03: <{^Raven^}> a bad idea and i don't believe it's possible to write anything interesting in such small source space
2005-07-30.txt:20:22:36: <graue> what was * is now space, what was + is now everything else
2005-07-30.txt:23:43:59: <graue> the spaces are the path
2005-07-31.txt:02:01:12: <calamari_> graue: in that scheme the only instructions would be @ and nop, depending on number of spaces, < > depending on turn direction, loops based on 3x3 block  
2005-07-31.txt:16:08:21: <Keymaker> grrh.. space invaders
2005-08-04.txt:01:39:22: <Gs30ng> is there any brainfuck-brother-lang which has many-dimensional memory space?
2005-08-04.txt:02:39:07: <Gs30ng> so it's a bf with 4 dimensional memory space?
2005-08-04.txt:03:27:21: <Gs30ng> well i think there's already one with 2-dim memory space
2005-08-04.txt:05:47:50: <Gs30ng> you meant the code space?
2005-08-04.txt:05:59:25: <Gs30ng> sounds like befunge code space or something
2005-08-05.txt:22:25:34: <int-e> predates namespaces, too.
2005-08-05.txt:22:32:28: <int-e> there wasn't much to update in that program - I renamed getchar and ungetchar and added a bunch of using namespace std.
2005-08-11.txt:00:37:55: <jix> fill unused space with random data
2005-08-12.txt:16:51:18: <tokigun> I suggest adding palette support and different color space rather than RGB to RXML
2005-08-12.txt:16:52:13: <tokigun> but different color space can be fun
2005-08-16.txt:18:46:58: <WildHalcyon> You'd need a pretty big code space to do that with reliable precision, wouldn't you?
2005-08-16.txt:18:47:37: <Gs30ng> or would i rather use brainfuck with 3d codespace?
2005-08-16.txt:18:48:30: <Gs30ng> i meant 3d memory space, not code space
2005-08-16.txt:18:49:44: <WildHalcyon> 3D memory space huh? A cube instead of a tape?
2005-08-16.txt:21:38:45: <Gs30ng> the space not should be 2 dimensional
2005-08-16.txt:22:25:04: <Gs30ng> NASA guys are calling him by period to ask some questions about the spaceship air supplying system written in bf
2005-08-16.txt:22:29:02: <GregorR> *checking door panels* *doors open* *doors close (well after the astronauts have been flung into space)* *reactivating oxygen*
2005-08-17.txt:00:06:28: <jix> (the space thing...)
2005-08-17.txt:00:23:50: <jix> and even the voyager space thing has a lot of SEX
2005-08-17.txt:22:28:09: <Gs30ng> where's the space to insert the code
2005-08-18.txt:06:39:03: <WildHalcyon> Its a funge-varient that implements function spaces that have their own topology (they wrap independent of the rest of the program). The stack is composed of lists, rather than separate elements (like Joy)
2005-08-20.txt:16:57:34: <nooga> will write numbers from 100 downto 1 separated by spaces ;p 
2005-08-20.txt:22:58:51: <nooga> i thought about a namespaces ;>
2005-08-21.txt:08:28:37: <tokigun> nooga: all whitespace is ignored?
2005-08-21.txt:11:51:05: <WildHalcyon> I think Nooga could free some more instructions if he was running low on implementation space
2005-08-22.txt:13:22:29: <tokigun> perhaps i have to use something like Ruby's objectspace
2005-08-23.txt:22:16:38: <WildHalcyon> As Ive mentioned more than is good for me, I'm creating a Funge-derivative which uses separate topological spaces for different functions, and each is given a label
2005-08-23.txt:22:17:32: <WildHalcyon> Im trying to think of a way in which to assign a cell to multiple function spaces simultaneously
2005-08-24.txt:21:56:14: <calamari> but it may hurt you as far as descriptions goes.. need space for text 
2005-08-24.txt:21:57:12: <{^Raven^}> but may add in functionality if you are running out of code space
2005-08-27.txt:18:48:36: <nooga> today i thought about a namespaces
2005-08-28.txt:22:00:43: <kipple_> will each user get his own storage space?
2005-08-28.txt:22:05:34: <calamari> iirc, graue was going to make an alternate namespace for EsoShell
2005-08-29.txt:11:20:27: <calamari> graue is (or did) create a special wiki namespace EsoShell
2005-08-29.txt:11:31:18: <calamari> hmm, I wonder if there is a way to get a list of all pages in a particular wiki namespace
2005-08-29.txt:13:55:31: <jix> 333 bytes of non-space code (the code is indented and not written for shortness)
2005-08-31.txt:22:49:12: <kipple> though perhaps a bit difficult to fit into such a small space
2005-09-04.txt:19:40:15: <kipple> true. it has a very limited code-space
2005-09-06.txt:10:30:57: <graue> I think we need a "hide esoshell namespace edits" patch for the recent changes page
2005-09-06.txt:10:31:12: <kipple> Is that because the Esoshell namespace is not properly configured?
2005-09-06.txt:10:31:24: <calamari_> kipple: yeah afaik there isn't an EsoShell nasespace yet
2005-09-06.txt:10:31:30: <kipple> I thought the recent changes only listed changes in the normal namespace
2005-09-06.txt:10:33:15: <calamari_> graue: is it difficult to add that namespace?
2005-09-06.txt:10:35:06: <graue> I have no idea about namespaces, but is there any problem with the current setup, other than the talk pages not being "EsoShell talk"?
2005-09-06.txt:10:36:37: <calamari_> graue: no, I thought you were wanting the namespace.. if you don't then it doesn't matter 
2005-09-06.txt:10:39:55: <kipple> to create a custom namespace you must edit the LocalSettings.php : http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Help:Custom_namespaces
2005-09-06.txt:10:51:08: <kipple> oops. are you messing with the namespaces, graue? ;)
2005-09-06.txt:10:55:21: <graue> actually, I should probably comment out the new namespaces, then go back and delete those pages, then add the namespaces again
2005-09-07.txt:14:09:06: <jix> that tries to save space
2005-09-07.txt:14:18:12: <jix> Aardwolf: reusing space