2007-11-02.txt:03:08:35: <oerjan> i've seen cpressey do some wiki posting
2007-11-02.txt:03:09:28: <oerjan> oh dear. cpressey, RUN!
2007-11-02.txt:03:43:16: <oerjan> cpressey: no, you need the ability to change infinitely many steps, which means there needs to be Swaps referring to them.
2008-01-08.txt:01:19:46: <oerjan> cpressey's webpage moves so often it could need one... :D
2008-02-04.txt:19:19:32: <oerjan> ais523: do you know if there is a way to make a template or something for catseye URLs so we don't have to change them all on the wiki every time cpressey moves around?
2008-02-04.txt:19:42:47: <oerjan> might even be some wayback links hiding in there, unless cpressey fixed it all
2009-06-12.txt:05:54:16: * oerjan swats the fake cpressey -----###
2010-01-15.txt:23:59:00: <oerjan> cpressey: long time no see
2010-01-16.txt:00:03:06: <oerjan> wtf i'm lagged, the logs show cpressey leaving before my greeting...
2010-01-16.txt:00:07:02: <ehird> [23:58] <oerjan> cpressey: long time no see
2010-01-19.txt:20:01:49: <oerjan> <cpressey> Actually, I advocate outlawing all medicine.  (Seriously.  A black market would probably work better than the current system.)
2010-01-19.txt:20:24:38: <AnMaster> oerjan, was it <cpressey> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MjMYQyhjiYA ?
2010-01-20.txt:16:54:10: <oerjan> cpressey: but if it's while, can't you skip it?
2010-01-20.txt:16:57:52: <oerjan> cpressey: um that was a pun, referring to your "next little while"
2010-01-28.txt:19:04:42: <oerjan> cpressey: no
2010-02-02.txt:21:46:46: <oerjan> cpressey: you'll have to cleanse it in holy water, i hear jews do that
2010-02-04.txt:00:29:40: <oerjan> no idea.  and cpressey just left.
2010-02-08.txt:15:39:18: * oerjan swats cpressey for having him google to find out the meaning of his own pun -----###
2010-02-08.txt:23:01:22: <oerjan> <cpressey> AnMaster: ha!  Well, let's just say Perl is such an exceptional language, it's an outlier, and thus disregarded.
2010-02-08.txt:23:04:07: <oerjan> <cpressey> I am eternally tempted to design a "real" language which "gets everything right".  It's a bad temptation.  It's better to stick to these weird little languages that intentionally get things "wrong"...
2010-02-09.txt:23:26:09: <oerjan> <cpressey> ais523: Then what would you call the property "I can map any Turing-machine to a (meaningfully different) program in this language"?
2010-02-09.txt:23:30:14: <oerjan> cpressey: um in that case i don't know what you mean
2010-02-09.txt:23:36:33: <oerjan> cpressey: ignore pikhq
2010-02-09.txt:23:39:38: <oerjan> cpressey: i think so
2010-02-09.txt:23:46:35: <oerjan> cpressey: i was just presenting LC as an example of a TC concept without input
2010-02-09.txt:23:48:36: <oerjan> cpressey: ah but L takes an input: a program + that program's input
2010-02-09.txt:23:51:33: <oerjan> cpressey: that's just because TMs are imperative with mutability.  in fact for certain purposes (e.g. space use analysis) it is common to give the TM its initial input on a separate, read-only tape
2010-02-09.txt:23:55:26: <oerjan> cpressey: that TMs can overwrite things - this is irrelevant to what they can _compute_
2010-02-10.txt:00:01:04: <oerjan> cpressey: to be honest i don't know that i've ever seen a clear and unambiguous definition of turing-completeness once you go beyond languages of strings.  the wikipedia article is certainly not one.
2010-02-10.txt:00:02:56: <oerjan> pikhq: but that sentence completely ignores the very I/O question which in my view is the reason for the confusing discussion i and cpressey are now having
2010-02-10.txt:00:04:43: <oerjan> cpressey: the thing is that most things you are reducing, such as NP-complete problems, don't have a program part.  you are reducing input to input
2010-02-10.txt:00:07:46: <oerjan> cpressey: and the RE theory simplifies everything to the bone by only using sets of _integers_
2010-02-10.txt:00:08:03: <cpressey> oerjan: <cpressey> ais523: Then what would you call the property "I can map any Turing-machine to a (meaningfully different) program in this language"?
2010-02-10.txt:00:09:46: <oerjan> cpressey: well it's critical for quines, which is where my first comment took inspiration.  but ok, as long as program and input are encoded separately it doesn't matter for this discussion.
2010-02-10.txt:00:10:47: <oerjan> cpressey: ah i just remembered.  look at the wiki's Narcissist page.
2010-02-10.txt:00:12:26: <oerjan> cpressey: and then i can ask you, is your property essential for the _existence_ of narcissists, like the "output-complete" idea is for the existence of quines?
2010-02-18.txt:18:09:28: <oerjan> cpressey: also, e is intuitively additive 0, while bottom is intuitively multiplicative 0
2010-02-18.txt:18:42:48: <oerjan> cpressey: "zero"
2010-02-18.txt:18:45:25: <oerjan> cpressey: also, if two programs x and y never halt, then x = xy = y
2010-02-18.txt:18:58:54: <oerjan> cpressey: you could think of 0 more as "never gives a result", in which case looping forever may not be mandatory
2010-02-18.txt:19:01:09: <oerjan> cpressey: what you might want then, is for results to form a group
2010-02-18.txt:19:44:56: <oerjan> cpressey: that won't distribute (a + b) * c properly unless c is linear
2010-02-19.txt:05:27:34: <oerjan> <AnMaster> <cpressey> "Execution of instructions in one program induces execution of instructions in another, nearby program."  Yes. <-- I first thought "what are you messing around with by doing induction over an uncountable set"
2010-02-19.txt:15:03:11: <oerjan> 21:27:34 <oerjan> <AnMaster> <cpressey> "Execution of instructions in one program induces execution of instructions in another, nearby program."  Yes. <-- I first thought "what are you messing around with by doing induction over an uncountable set"
2010-02-20.txt:15:19:24: <oerjan> alise: well yes in fact i think cpressey may done that already
2010-02-22.txt:20:10:51: <oerjan> <AnMaster> cpressey, btw, how is the pen colour and paper colour supposed to work for real turtle bots?
2010-02-23.txt:18:04:00: <oerjan> cpressey: in _principle_ you could track exact algebraic expressions :D
2010-02-23.txt:18:07:54: <oerjan> cpressey: that's what i assumed you meant
2010-02-24.txt:01:38:30: <oerjan> cpressey (the inventor) has recently started coming here again
2010-02-24.txt:21:51:05: <oerjan> 08:29:21 <AnMaster> cpressey, what about the one of ick?
2010-02-26.txt:21:08:30: <oerjan> cpressey: no no, it will be a bottle with a message inside
2010-02-26.txt:23:13:38: <oerjan> cpressey: it is hard to determine that, because the law is metacircularly self-applying
2010-03-01.txt:23:02:28: <oerjan> cpressey: even ghc cannot do it without you having loaded the modules defining the type instances, i think.
2010-03-01.txt:23:04:14: <oerjan> cpressey: in addition to the standard Int and Integer, the Int* and Word* types from Data.Int and Data.Word
2010-03-01.txt:23:07:49: <oerjan> cpressey: http://www.haskell.org/ghc/docs/latest/html/libraries/base/Prelude.html has a sizable list a way down
2010-03-03.txt:23:44:53: <oerjan> cpressey: that wouldn't be auto- would it.
2010-03-04.txt:00:41:04: <oerjan> cpressey: i think if something like wolfram's theory that the universe is generated by a small program is true, then we might eventually find it (or an equivalent program), although we would never be able to prove that it was completely accurate
2010-03-04.txt:00:44:19: <oerjan> cpressey: that seems to lack a certain necessary complexity
2010-03-08.txt:18:25:46: <oerjan> cpressey: you might want it to use the first two _lines_ output
2010-03-09.txt:16:19:39: * oerjan beats cpressey with the saucepan of doom ===\__/
2010-03-09.txt:16:23:05: <oerjan> cpressey: clearly then addition is demonic
2010-03-09.txt:17:44:07: <oerjan> cpressey: the poker sense
2010-03-09.txt:22:45:28: <oerjan> cpressey: you're quite limber, i take
2010-03-10.txt:16:35:31: <oerjan> cpressey: they're equivalent by my argument, in intuitionistic logic
2010-03-10.txt:16:40:28: <oerjan> cpressey: @x = x is not inconsistent if @ has nothing to do with "not"
2010-03-10.txt:16:41:39: <oerjan> cpressey: and by nothing to do with "not", i mean that you throw away all the other axioms of !
2010-03-10.txt:16:42:18: <oerjan> fax: i don't think cpressey knows yet :D
2010-03-10.txt:16:42:50: <oerjan> cpressey: if you have just @x = x, you cannot prove x = y for all x and y
2010-03-10.txt:16:45:11: <oerjan> cpressey: for example say that @x has the meaning !!x
2010-03-10.txt:17:00:24: <oerjan> cpressey: if there is only one value, then @x = x is obviously true
2010-03-10.txt:17:07:04: <oerjan> cpressey: also it is not a requirement of logics to be defined by reductions or have normal forms...
2010-03-12.txt:22:59:44: <oerjan> cpressey: have you looked at eodermdrome?
2010-03-12.txt:23:03:34: <oerjan> cpressey: if you don't _want_ your language to be that hard to run, you could probably select instruction graphs that were somewhat easier to recognize
2010-03-27.txt:22:30:57: <oerjan> hm wait cpressey has burrito, maybe he has an enchilada too
2010-04-05.txt:00:07:41: <oerjan> otherwise, cpressey already tried that.  (burro, was it?)
2010-04-05.txt:00:07:47: <ehirdiphone> oerjan: hey, cpressey managed it but hs inverses weren't thr same
2010-06-07.txt:21:29:20: <oerjan> hi cpressey
2010-06-08.txt:22:20:15: <oerjan> * cpressey wonders where fax is these days <-- i banned her a while ago, after she went completely ballistic.
2010-06-08.txt:22:27:47: <oerjan> cpressey is no ghost.  afaik.
2010-06-09.txt:14:48:59: <oerjan> yo cpressey
2010-06-12.txt:00:02:09: <oerjan> 09:06:02 * cpressey bans himself
2010-06-12.txt:00:02:09: <oerjan> 09:06:11 <ais523> cpressey: bad puns are oerjan's job!
2010-06-15.txt:15:30:39: <oerjan> cpressey: i agree that your goldbach language needs work - for one thing it's not hard to find arbitrary large even numbers that are sums of two odd primes
2010-06-16.txt:15:20:58: <oerjan> waga: cpressey is famous here
2010-06-17.txt:16:41:15: <oerjan> cpressey: you probably need big ints to actually _use_ most of those unbounded string parts, don't you?
2010-06-17.txt:16:42:40: <oerjan> cpressey: hm right, assuming right$(X,6) is everything from index 6 until the end?
2010-06-17.txt:16:43:23: <oerjan> cpressey: um that's not enough for a cyclic tag system then
2010-06-17.txt:16:45:55: <oerjan> cpressey: i was just wondering if MID$ took until the end of the string if you dropped the last argument
2010-06-17.txt:21:08:55: <oerjan> cpressey: i recall n was originally 16 in 8088
2010-06-18.txt:18:28:23: <oerjan> cpressey: i don't think EgoBot has python, no.
2010-06-18.txt:19:37:52: <oerjan> cpressey: wait, i vaguely thought i'd seen alex2012 before.  which means i might _vaguely_ bet.
2010-06-18.txt:19:59:27: <oerjan> `addquote * Phantom_Hoover wonders where the size of the compiled Linux kernel comes from. <cpressey> To comply with the GFDL, there's a copy of Wikipedia in there.
2010-06-21.txt:22:26:00: <oerjan> cpressey: well it's all diagonalization
2010-06-22.txt:19:51:41: <oerjan> cpressey: oh
2010-06-22.txt:20:55:20: <oerjan> and if cpressey then gets fired it isn't his fault
2010-06-23.txt:22:41:34: <oerjan> cpressey: you seem to be having a nick identity crisis?
2010-06-25.txt:18:15:22: <oerjan> cpressey: i see Chan as an unGetChan function which you could presumably use to put the value back if the case doesn't match
2010-06-28.txt:23:38:40: <oerjan> however, my idea here was that the reverse should be capable of doing what cpressey asked
2010-06-28.txt:23:43:38: <oerjan> cpressey: i note that http://unicode-search.net/unicode-namesearch.pl?term=gamma&.submit=Send+foresp%C3%B8rsel&subs=1&print=1 gives a whole slew of hits for "gamma"
2010-06-28.txt:23:45:03: <oerjan> cpressey: well it means there's a lot to extract
2010-06-28.txt:23:47:09: <oerjan> cpressey: however note that there are already _two_ common hits there, capital and small
2010-06-29.txt:21:06:49: <oerjan> cpressey: no.
2010-06-29.txt:21:16:54: <oerjan> cpressey: well anyway AND doesn't require any, so the points where you apply NOT are sort of the important ones? (this is very vague memory)
2010-06-29.txt:21:27:29: <oerjan> cpressey: circuit complexity is cool :)
2010-06-29.txt:21:55:52: <oerjan> cpressey: actually that gives a simple solution, just let the language consist of strings of the form RE_1,RE_2 where RE_1 RE_2 are/alternatively aren't representing the same language
2010-07-07.txt:23:05:01: <oerjan> 07:30:43 <cpressey> <ais523> also amusing: Haskell has the same LR(infinity) parsing issues as INTERCAL
2010-07-07.txt:23:05:04: <oerjan> 07:30:46 <cpressey> That's just sad.
2010-07-08.txt:23:01:57: <oerjan> <cpressey> aliseiphone: I'm trying to unify scanning, parsing, and immediate and deferred execution into a single, coherent, ugly framework.
2010-07-08.txt:23:06:52: <oerjan> cpressey: well that's the little i think i understand of it, anyway.
2010-07-08.txt:23:18:28: <oerjan> cpressey: the problem is that once you've observed the pun, it's not quantum anymore
2010-07-12.txt:23:35:30: <oerjan> <cpressey> Er, right.  A newtype is a, what word would work better - "synonym"?  It has the same structure but has a distinct identity.
2010-07-12.txt:23:36:37: <oerjan> cpressey: a newtype is sometimes called a "wrapper"
2010-07-12.txt:23:55:00: <oerjan> <AnMaster> cpressey, that it is a special form, well or syntax. Is "let" a special form in haskell? I guess it is.
2010-07-15.txt:23:50:17: <oerjan> CakeProphet: that's essentially the "ending in * 0 chain" cpressey was mentioning
2010-07-16.txt:00:17:47: <oerjan> cpressey: um i'm pretty sure "heathen" must be a calque on "pagan"...
2010-07-20.txt:18:36:39: <oerjan> cpressey: sure
2010-07-20.txt:18:51:31: <oerjan> cpressey: ok
2010-07-20.txt:19:43:17: <oerjan> cpressey: not only did they do so, but you invented narcissists because of it
2010-07-20.txt:22:54:09: <oerjan> cpressey: now you have even more reason to learn underload *evil cackle*
2010-07-21.txt:20:24:51: <oerjan> CakeProphet: you can't see the forest of cpressey's argument for the trees?
2010-07-27.txt:00:24:44: <oerjan> cpressey: well it's a fairly obvious idea i guess once you get the bell inequality kind of stuff that shows you cannot use only local, forward causality to explain QM
2010-07-27.txt:23:02:57: <oerjan> <cpressey> And: Will my unit tests pass this time?
2010-07-28.txt:00:06:12: <oerjan> cpressey: webcomic mad scientists
2010-07-28.txt:00:08:06: <oerjan> cpressey: well the previous time i saw it was a joke about norwegians afaict
2010-07-28.txt:00:08:53: <oerjan> cpressey: if it was Phantom_Hoover each time, presumably he's been reading the archive
2010-07-28.txt:15:43:37: <Phantom_Hoover> oerjan! cpressey! Mathnerd314!
2010-07-28.txt:23:35:11: <oerjan> <cpressey> I did wonder once if you could make a game out of NTMs -- one player tries to choose transitions that will make the machine accept, the other tries to choose transitions that will make it reject
2010-07-28.txt:23:42:00: <oerjan> cpressey: or to put it differently, if an alternating turing machine is played as a game where one player does all the universal transitions and tries to make it reject, and the other player does all the existensial transitions and tries to make it accept, then perfect play gives exactly the same result as the usual ATM interpretation
2010-07-28.txt:23:57:02: <oerjan> <cpressey> The wikipedia article on Sudoku is in the category "NP-complete problems", but mentions nothing about it on the page.  Yay Wikipedia
2010-07-28.txt:23:59:08: <oerjan> cpressey: oh they've split things out into a Mathematics of Sudoku article
2010-07-29.txt:00:02:48: <oerjan> <cpressey> Does Co-NP = NP?
2010-07-29.txt:00:04:00: <oerjan> cpressey: well P=NP would imply NP=co-NP
2010-07-29.txt:00:19:46: <oerjan> <cpressey> Complete guess: SAT with monotonic sentences (no NOT) is in P.  Maybe even a greedy algorithm
2010-07-29.txt:00:28:44: <oerjan> cpressey: i assume that's an american-only pun
2010-07-29.txt:17:03:05: <oerjan> cpressey: it's a trivial application of the pigeonhole principle
2010-07-29.txt:23:04:43: <oerjan> cpressey: dick lipton over at the Godel's Lost Letter blog uses "Conventional Wisdom" as a slightly derogatory term.
2010-07-30.txt:00:12:33: <oerjan> cpressey: seems connected to #P and PP
2010-07-30.txt:00:15:55: <oerjan> cpressey: um no it's not whether it's exactly half, it's whether the number is even or odd
2010-07-30.txt:00:23:02: <oerjan> cpressey: um no that's primality
2010-07-30.txt:00:49:41: <oerjan> cpressey: or we cannot prove they actually give the right answer
2010-07-30.txt:23:42:27: <oerjan> cpressey: ' and , are illegal.  @--- should work, however
2010-08-03.txt:04:05:28: <oerjan> <Phantom_Hoover> cpressey, I thought lament's real name was Nikita something?
2010-08-04.txt:03:58:24: <oerjan> `addquote <AnMaster> cpressey, oh go to zzo's website. He is NIH  <Phantom_Hoover> AnMaster, really? I was strongly under the impression that zzo was invented here.
2010-08-04.txt:18:09:21: <oerjan> cpressey: it doesn't provide a lazy number type, by default
2010-08-04.txt:18:11:33: <oerjan> cpressey: um a list of digits is just one possible implementation of a lazy number type
2010-08-05.txt:19:12:36: <oerjan> cpressey: well if Fruit is a Monad, you can use do blocks for that purpose
2010-08-05.txt:19:22:34: <oerjan> cpressey: hm maybe it's been added recently - i think it was said they'd add it if someone made a patch
2010-08-05.txt:19:51:01: <oerjan> cpressey: the last is an example of a Monad where _part_ of the monad value is strict in the first argument to >>, and _part_ is strict in the second :)
2010-08-05.txt:20:54:10: <oerjan> cpressey: you're not the first one to use that term :)
2010-08-05.txt:20:57:59: <oerjan> cpressey: uncurry . flip, i think
2010-08-05.txt:21:00:44: <oerjan> cpressey: i think many of ghc's optimization rules for lists depend on using fold/map style rather than explicit recursion
2010-08-05.txt:21:56:42: <oerjan> cpressey: if it involves evaluating variables, the results are cached
2010-08-05.txt:21:58:46: <oerjan> cpressey: semantically seq does nothing other than check whether the first argument is undefined before returning the second
2010-08-05.txt:22:09:19: <oerjan> cpressey: i recall from a previous comment that your last sentence there might _not_ be sarcasm? :D
2010-08-05.txt:22:15:17: <oerjan> cpressey: well yeah and also a 3-time repetition rule
2010-08-05.txt:22:20:16: <oerjan> zzo38: i assumed that was what cpressey meant by recursion limit
2010-08-05.txt:22:37:36: <oerjan> cpressey: evaluations/pure computations?
2010-08-05.txt:22:41:06: <oerjan> cpressey: i don't think so, more like data is a subset of codata
2010-08-06.txt:17:56:40: <oerjan> cpressey: monads force an order of _effects_.  even in IO, evaluation of pure values is not always forced.
2010-08-06.txt:23:39:10: <oerjan> cpressey: what about myndzi's last link?
2010-08-06.txt:23:41:01: <oerjan> cpressey: no it was just a guess
2010-08-09.txt:20:04:57: <oerjan> `addquote <cpressey> Never ever use a quote which contains both the words "aloofness" and "gel" (verb).
2010-08-09.txt:20:18:14: <oerjan> cpressey: there are lots of variations of P vs. NP question
2010-08-09.txt:20:18:20: <oerjan> cpressey: um you serious? :D
2010-08-09.txt:20:19:17: <oerjan> cpressey: he _could_ be from here, not everyone here has revealed their real name
2010-08-09.txt:20:19:27: <oerjan> AnMaster: oh that's cpressey :D
2010-08-09.txt:20:23:06: <oerjan> cpressey: by "variation" i mean other questions that are slightly different (often by adding an oracle)
2010-08-09.txt:20:26:59: <oerjan> cpressey: of course you can, the problem is that _most_ methods in complexity theory allow you to add an arbitrary oracle to a proof
2010-08-09.txt:20:27:29: <oerjan> cpressey: heh
2010-08-09.txt:20:28:19: <oerjan> cpressey: well hopefully this guy found a non-crap method :)
2010-08-09.txt:20:33:38: <oerjan> cpressey: apparently random SAT instances are involved in the proof, i recall
2010-08-09.txt:22:24:32: <oerjan> cpressey: you cannot be both expert and any of the two others, imo
2010-08-10.txt:20:45:21: <oerjan> <cpressey> In programming in general.  In mathematics -- I'll turn a blind eye.
2010-08-10.txt:20:45:46: <oerjan> <cpressey> Tuples suck.
2010-08-10.txt:21:03:27: <oerjan> oklopol: that's not crucial to what cpressey was discussing, i think.  both tuples and lists allow arbitrary typed _contents_ in python
2010-08-10.txt:21:29:22: <oerjan> i guess you'll have to wait for cpressey to return for that :)
2010-08-14.txt:04:04:40: <oerjan> cpressey: you can rebind keys to your heart's content anyhow (i vaguely recall i rebound Home and End to go top and bottom of scrollback instead of beginning/end of line)
2010-08-14.txt:05:02:26: <oerjan> cpressey: YOU HAVE DOOMED US ALL
2010-09-04.txt:00:22:37: <oerjan> <fizzie> cpressey: A friend just facebooked (and a friend-of-a-friend told a similiar story) about a plumber that came to fix something, left saying "I'll need to go get some more tools from the car", and then never came back (or at least not in two weeks).
2010-09-04.txt:00:39:10: <oerjan> <cpressey> Phantom_Hoover: OOB seems to "tag" a value with a special invisible quality which makes some built-in functions do something different with it when they receive it.
2010-09-04.txt:23:59:59: <oerjan> <cpressey> I think it is, because I think you can encode SMETANA in it, but my brain isn't really working <-- SMETANA isn't TC
2010-09-05.txt:00:01:33: <oerjan> <cpressey> Oh btw, that P != NP proof was debunked, wasn't it?
2010-09-05.txt:01:05:11: <oerjan> cpressey: in any case you need try if you want anything to recover from a fail that consumes characters
2010-09-05.txt:04:53:32: <oerjan> cpressey: a pizza party with a pony parade is no basis for a system of government
2010-09-06.txt:18:19:29: <oerjan> cpressey: definitely not what you borrowed, it had too many #'s
2010-09-06.txt:18:36:59: <oerjan> cpressey: that sounds rather close to lambda to me.  i guess it could still do weird things with nesting
2010-09-06.txt:18:39:57: <oerjan> cpressey: that sounds like a zzo38 quote :D
2010-09-07.txt:04:05:04: <oerjan> 17:10:19 * cpressey cues oerjan
2010-09-07.txt:04:41:37: <oerjan> cpressey: i'm pretty sure that false is an ordinary linux command, not an esolang
2010-09-07.txt:22:17:04: <oerjan> cpressey: unstated assumption is you have no border cells
2010-09-08.txt:17:15:37: <oerjan> <Phantom_Hoover> 15:50:29 <cpressey> unlambda in unlambda 15:51:21 <cpressey> that's just not right <-- Unlambda in Lazy K is even shorter, I think.
2010-09-08.txt:17:31:11: <oerjan> <cpressey> Isn't /tmp kind of an "antipattern" (though I despise that word)?  ~/tmp would be better, except for the doesn't-count-for-quota/could-get-deleted-at-any-time rules, but those could be implemented some other way.
2010-09-08.txt:19:49:07: <oerjan> cpressey, stuck in the antipattern of using "antipattern"
2010-09-11.txt:21:39:54: <oerjan> cpressey: i've read that about Jung, not so much Darwin...
2010-09-11.txt:21:45:01: <oerjan> cpressey: i saw in the logs you asked about > binary operations, i know at least one called "median algebras", me and Rustad tried to publish an article connected to them but iirc it was rejected twice so we stopped.  presumably it seemed too trivial.
2010-09-11.txt:21:48:11: <oerjan> cpressey: i guess we could have got it accepted by aiming lower with the journal, if we'd bothered
2010-09-11.txt:21:50:16: <oerjan> cpressey: incidentally if you are familiar with the 2-SAT problem (analogous to 3-SAT and higher, but in P), the solutions to a 2-SAT problem form a median algebra
2010-09-11.txt:21:54:57: <oerjan> cpressey: there are of course heaps of obscure kinds of algebras if one wants to look for them
2010-09-12.txt:04:18:20: <oerjan> cpressey: well the rosetta thing breaks down for the part "DER DE ENESTE PERSONEN OERJAN" since it clearly doesn't mean that i conquered anything.  well unless i killed everyone else, i guess.
2010-09-12.txt:05:01:13: <oerjan> cpressey: the number changes with each command
2010-09-12.txt:20:35:15: <oerjan> 11:22:24 <cpressey> Pstate.  Like Psmith.
2010-09-12.txt:20:38:09: <oerjan> cpressey: or is that from wodehouse? (who i haven't read but google says so)
2010-09-12.txt:22:41:38: <oerjan> cpressey: i think i've seen incremental
2010-09-12.txt:22:44:40: <oerjan> cpressey: it _may_ indicate something stronger though, where you don't just add more text but can even reparse after internal edits (more effeciently than reparsing _everything_)
2010-09-12.txt:22:46:32: <oerjan> cpressey: also i think the newfangled iteratee/enumerator concept for haskell (by oleg) is intended to support this
2010-09-12.txt:22:55:08: <oerjan> cpressey: in fact it seems that the iteratee people use "incremental" in the sense you want, while some other researchers use the stronger edit meaning
2010-09-12.txt:23:06:40: <oerjan> cpressey: this stuff is important to haskell because haskell requires you to make parsing incremental if you want to have the parser be pure code but still allow interleaving impure actions with parsing
2010-09-14.txt:00:47:56: <oerjan> cpressey: spoilsport :D
2010-09-14.txt:00:49:03: <oerjan> cpressey: *commutative (although you want associative too, with more arguments)
2010-09-14.txt:01:37:40: <oerjan> cpressey: i point you to /// which basically does _nothing_ but the two things you mention ;D
2010-09-14.txt:02:20:22: <oerjan> cpressey: R is in violation of the universal declaration of human rights!
2010-09-16.txt:16:35:44: <oerjan> cpressey: oh.
2010-09-16.txt:16:49:20: <oerjan> cpressey: you're forgetting the antipodes!
2010-10-04.txt:23:37:15: <oerjan> cpressey: i just did /notice #esoteric Testing...
2010-10-05.txt:17:17:55: <oerjan> hi cpressey
2010-10-05.txt:23:31:05: <oerjan> cpressey: basically that the restricted problem of looking _just_ at < k edge intersecting graphs may be polynomial to decide for a fixed k even if it is exponential in k
2010-10-05.txt:23:32:50: <oerjan> cpressey: for example i recall that the problem of deciding whether one graph is isomorphic to a subgraph of another is NP-complete, but if the smaller graph is _fixed_ (or bounded in size) then it's a polynomial problem
2010-10-06.txt:00:25:43: <oerjan> cpressey: YES and i agree
2010-10-06.txt:18:16:09: <oerjan> <cpressey> Does lambdabot keep messages for us, too?
2010-10-06.txt:18:17:27: <oerjan> @tell cpressey Sure it does!
2010-10-06.txt:18:45:22: <oerjan> cpressey: erm why didn't it tell you :(
2010-10-06.txt:18:46:18: <oerjan> cpressey: try saying something without lambdabot: in front
2010-10-07.txt:01:36:07: <oerjan> cpressey: surely that's borrowed from lisp
2010-10-07.txt:02:44:10: <oerjan> cpressey: i think someone said factor was removed again for some reason
2010-10-07.txt:02:49:13: <oerjan> it seems to have ignored some of cpressey's messages
2010-10-08.txt:06:19:55: <oerjan> 21:55:26 <cpressey> 23:51 < Riastradh> Boo!
2010-10-08.txt:06:19:55: <oerjan> 21:59:30 <cpressey> what's a good language to rewrite it in?
2010-10-08.txt:21:16:37: <pikhq> And oerjan is older than cpressey.
2010-10-09.txt:05:41:45: <oerjan> cpressey: and the star of this year's nobel prize in physics
2010-10-10.txt:05:14:06: <oerjan> <cpressey> the only programming language from south korea i know of, is an esolang.
2010-10-10.txt:18:15:06: * oerjan kicks cpressey through an ultrafilter
2010-10-11.txt:07:14:45: <oerjan> <cpressey> @tell oerjan The problem with the "non-self-similar fractal" of a triangle, square, pentagon... is that as n gets large, n-gons do tend to look... well, similar.
2010-10-12.txt:18:09:25: <oerjan> cpressey: :t foldl' didn't work because foldl' is not in the Prelude
2010-10-12.txt:18:21:12: <oerjan> cpressey: join is already taken for a monadic function, though
2010-10-12.txt:18:23:11: <oerjan> cpressey: um what would that do?
2010-10-12.txt:18:23:50: <oerjan> Vorpal: i'm asking cpressey
2010-10-12.txt:18:29:27: <oerjan> cpressey: yeah that accumulator doesn't work well with laziness
2010-10-12.txt:18:29:57: <Vorpal> oerjan, the problem is, cpressey is too lazy to fix it
2010-10-12.txt:18:30:52: <oerjan> cpressey: what's doctests?
2010-10-12.txt:18:48:48: <oerjan> cpressey: well nothing preventing you from writing such comments, then
2010-10-12.txt:18:51:35: <oerjan> cpressey: haskell has several test suites as well as haddock for documentation.  not that i've used them.
2010-10-12.txt:18:55:05: <oerjan> cpressey: my _vague_ understanding is quickcheck and smallcheck are useful in haskell for testing == kind of things, and hunit for actual IO related stuff
2010-10-13.txt:22:14:32: <oerjan> even cpressey doesn't know, the nsa wipe his memory whenever he leaves and reinstate it when he comes back
2010-11-25.txt:16:39:25: <elliott> oerjan: now we just need cpressey back
2010-12-13.txt:23:58:10: <oerjan> ooh, cpressey linkified feather on the wiki.  i think this means we are all doomed.
2010-12-21.txt:01:58:28: <elliott> oerjan: it was actually a language i managed to trick cpressey into semi-designing before he buggered off irc :)
2010-12-22.txt:16:35:03: <elliott> oerjan: as the premier wiki sysop, you should slap cpressey for decreasing the sum total of the world's happiness significantly: http://esolangs.org/w/index.php?title=Talk:Brainfuck&curid=1138&diff=20541&oldid=20540
2010-12-25.txt:21:17:41: <elliott> oerjan: can you get a rubber hose to beat cpressey with?
2010-12-27.txt:18:22:23: <oerjan> ...i already did a similar correction, as did cpressey
2011-02-20.txt:03:56:38: <elliott> oerjan: consider that 90% of the things cpressey said in here were elaborate yarns about insane language features that turned out to be actual falcon features.
2011-03-11.txt:18:55:04: <oerjan> <elliott> cpressey: there is no operator for the other way around (unless you define one) <-- Control.Arrow.>>>
2011-03-11.txt:20:40:22: <oerjan> cpressey: HE DOESN'T REALLY EXIST
2011-03-11.txt:20:42:30: <oerjan> cpressey: but it's the perfect setup for not being there afterward
2011-03-13.txt:01:34:44: <oerjan> cpressey: we _could_ set the channel +t for a while, i guess...
2011-03-13.txt:01:35:10: <oerjan> cpressey: prevent topic changes
2011-03-13.txt:01:52:58: <oerjan> cpressey: myxomatosis.
2011-03-13.txt:01:54:47: <oerjan> cpressey: it was a counterresponse to "all rabbit pictures are cute rabbit pictures"
2011-03-13.txt:02:13:23: <oerjan> cpressey: i don't know if there's a specific word for tie in tic-tac-toe in norwegian
2011-03-13.txt:02:49:02: <oerjan> cpressey: there is at least one place it's a link, in a message by a google employee in the link i pasted a bit further up
2011-03-13.txt:02:55:25: <oerjan> cpressey: there definitely don't seem to be any high-ranked pages _warning_ against it, though
2011-03-21.txt:22:46:26: <oerjan> cpressey: um do you have your precedence right there
2011-03-21.txt:22:50:00: <oerjan> cpressey: um i thought you were disagreeing with my adding parentheses above?
2011-03-21.txt:22:50:41: <oerjan> cpressey: because you were talking about continued fractions and they use a/(b+c)
2011-03-21.txt:22:52:33: <oerjan> cpressey: also in haskell "is evaluated before" is rather distinct from precedence >:)
2011-03-21.txt:22:53:56: <oerjan> <cpressey> of course this means we need an esolang where the precedence varies in a difficult-to-predict way <-- i think oklopol had something like that
2011-03-29.txt:22:26:20: <oerjan> cpressey: sounds like it should be doable if the commands just fail to commutate enough
2011-03-29.txt:22:47:28: * oerjan accidentally cpressey's air guitar
2011-03-30.txt:01:52:37: <oerjan> catseye: you're not cpressey are you?
2011-03-30.txt:02:02:12: <oerjan> Gregor: can you confirm or deny whether you and cpressey are secretly Bastet worshippers inventing the concept of esolangs to draw nerds into your esoteric sect?
2011-03-30.txt:20:03:25: <oerjan> cpressey: hey C++ is person oriented, it annoys everyone!
2011-03-30.txt:20:59:41: <oerjan> cpressey: if you plunge a wormhole into the sun, you really want to be careful where you put the other end.  just saying.
2011-03-30.txt:21:26:14: <oerjan> cpressey: shhh
2011-03-30.txt:21:27:59: <oerjan> cpressey: clearly in his heart he doesn't want to stay away, but if we remind him he might stubbornly resist...
2011-04-05.txt:16:33:35: <oerjan> cpressey: _ is a special pattern and not an identifier
2011-04-05.txt:16:52:54: <oerjan> cpressey: the difference here may be that a do block cannot be empty while a let block can
2011-04-06.txt:20:40:04: * oerjan adds some coolant to cpressey's head to prevent it exploding
2011-04-07.txt:18:23:56: <oerjan> <cpressey> Longhair + living on the streets = permanent knots in fur = quite painful, I imagine = not the happiest individual.
2011-04-07.txt:18:33:12: <oerjan> <cpressey> I mean, I have seen xkcd's involuntarily on peoples' shirts and hanging in their cubes, and it didn't damage me *too* much.
2011-04-07.txt:19:22:12: <oerjan> <cpressey> I haven't worked it out -- such a railgun might have to be really, really long. [...] <-- i have this hunch part of the problem is you don't want the speed to get too high until you've passed most of the atmosphere...
2011-04-08.txt:20:54:18: <oerjan> <cpressey> er... can you change the precedence of built-in operators in haskell? <-- you can introduce a new operator with the same name and any precedence you want, as long as you hide the original one when importing.
2011-04-08.txt:21:03:23: <oerjan> <cpressey> who would write "let in 3" in haskell? <-- i suppose they allowed empty let blocks for easier automatic code generation or something
2011-04-08.txt:21:55:13: <oerjan> `addquote <cpressey> BYE dbc WE'LL BE SURE TO ACCIDENTALLY MENTION YOUR NICK OFTEN
2011-04-09.txt:00:19:55: <ZOMGMODULES> but the snazzy part comes from that session where oerjan and cpressey were abusing Haskell
2011-04-13.txt:21:33:57: <oerjan> <cpressey> ugh, is there like a published directory hierarchy standard for Haskell packages?
2011-04-13.txt:21:34:11: <oerjan> <cpressey> oh, oerjan's gone now.  durt
2011-04-13.txt:21:34:27: <oerjan> <oerjan> oh, cpressey's gone now.  durt
2011-04-13.txt:21:41:08: <oerjan> @tell cpressey http://www.haskell.org/haskellwiki/Hierarchical_module_names
2011-04-13.txt:21:44:15: <oerjan> <cpressey> "Spark is a new dialect of Lisp that aims to be popular, useful and used for real-world tasks. Eventually we hope that people will get payed to write in Spark, sometimes against their will."
2011-04-13.txt:21:47:54: <oerjan> <cpressey> As long as they don't get payed to do spellchecking, I supose.
2011-04-13.txt:21:53:49: <oerjan> <elliott> cpressey: yes, but they might demote you to sysop for it
2011-04-13.txt:22:06:51: <oerjan> cpressey: you might want to read last half hour's logs
2011-04-13.txt:22:07:52: * oerjan tears apart cpressey's newly printed certificate of clairvoyance
2011-04-13.txt:22:41:09: <oerjan> cpressey: hm?
2011-04-13.txt:23:16:43: <oerjan> cpressey: impressive, you were less coherent than fungot's answer
2011-04-24.txt:17:26:33: <oerjan> elliott_: it would be a variant of cpressey's language that i forget the name of
2011-04-29.txt:23:32:15: <oerjan> cpressey: it's because it's an abbreviation
2011-04-29.txt:23:38:21: <oerjan> cpressey: no, it is sent as a PRIVMSG
2011-04-29.txt:23:44:11: <oerjan> cpressey: pretty much :D
2011-05-02.txt:19:54:59: <oerjan> well cpressey is the one with an "implement multiple esolangs in javascript" project, isn't he
2011-05-08.txt:22:49:54: <oerjan> except cpressey may not realize he is one
[too many lines; stopping]